He Wants To Quit HIs Day Job To Be In Wine. Meet Armen Ghazikhanian

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This is a hobby and this is where my

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passion lies. And sometimes your passion, it just

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ignites and it just. You get deeper and deeper. And as

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you said, wine industry is something that the more

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you learn, the more you realize that you don't know.

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Sit back and grab a glass. It's Wine Talks

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with Paul K. Hey, welcome to Wine Talks with

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Paul K. And we are in studio today about to have a conversation with Armin

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Gazet Ganyan of Cork and Bottle. Introductions in

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just a moment. Hey, have a listen to a show that I did recently with

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Chad Luddington. This guy, I mean, he's got a

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PhD, two masters, I don't know how many bas, but he's a

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historian. But a wine historian. It's a

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fascinating conversation. Have a listen to that. But not while we're here. We're here to

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have a conversation with Armin at Cork and Bottle. Welcome to the show.

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Thank you for having me. Good to see you After. How long has it been

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that we saw each other? It's been about six months now. Right. Well,

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we get around to the stuff once in a while. Yeah. It just seems like

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yesterday. Well, we met at. At Guinea Fest, which, of

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course, for the listeners. Guinea means wine in

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Armenia. And then there's a local festival in Los Angeles that. That

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highlights Armenian wine is turned into other products as well now. But

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I have to tell you something. When I was there, I tasted every

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wine that was there. It was about 75 total.

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But that's work, work, work for me, you know? Yeah.

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And I had not heard of Cork and Bottle at the time,

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wasn't part of the regular mainstream distributors of.

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Of wine. I was so impressed with the quality and

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this and the curating. You know, it's kind of a

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tough word to use in our business, but it's the curating of your

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list. So. But that's not your day job.

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No. Or it wasn't your day job. It seems like

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it's about to be my day job. Yeah. Good. It's

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growing on me now. Well, I could wish. I could wish you

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nothing but good luck in getting into this industry. Good luck,

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meaning I hope that it works out for you because it is a fabulous industry.

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Yes. And it turns you on to so many different parts of culture in the

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world. But. But what do you do then, normally?

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Well, I've been in finance business for 20 years. Oh,

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I see. Working fin. For, for and in financial

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institution, corporation. So it's been a

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great journey in that sense. And I'm still

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in that industry currently self employed.

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And but yeah, so I worked a lot with business

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owners and helped them advise

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them about business finance and access to

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capital and loans

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and all the types of everything that business owners

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they may need depending on where they are

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with J.P. morgan. And you know, that's. And I have

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a similar background. I was with corporate America, my wife was with corporate America. We

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both became wine in the wine trade. But

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has that experience at JP Morgan set you up

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for A, being in your own business, which is now

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only a few months old and B starting something from

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scratch? Well, yeah, I mean

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that experience was hands on.

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It's not something that you can learn at school, you can

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go to the best schools, but read all these great books. But nothing

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compares to being hands on, doing something that you really

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enjoy and love. And that's what my passion was in

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and is, is helping business owners helping people

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grow and in what they do and what

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they're passionate about. And my expertise was in business and working

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with business owners. So some were

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just launching their businesses, some were

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semi few years in their

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business and some were already matured in their business so

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they were winding down. So I've seen business owners in all the

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stages of their business and what the struggles are and also

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the economy. I mean I was in finance when

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2007, 2008, I saw what happened.

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Right. And then 2013, 14. So I've seen all the

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cycle, life cycle for business owners, what they do and successful business

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owners, what they do, how they protect themselves and those people that

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basically, unfortunately they can't

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handle the economy or the flow of the business and

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they fail, but they come back again. So it was a

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great experience and I think that gave me a

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great hands on experience of one day if I'm going to have

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my own business, what to do and what not to do. But again, you never

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know until you start your business and it's always a little bit different.

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Well, nothing can be more true than that in the wine business.

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Totally. So I'm going to sort of throw this at you because it is

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a business that seems to be immune from what would be

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traditionally business school tactics. What you

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get out of the books like you talked about, I think

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wine is very similar to that in that you can read all the books about

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Bordeaux and Burgundy, but until you go there and smell the dirt and taste the

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wines, you know, it doesn't really help you that much. But did you find that

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so far? And we're going to talk about the cork and bottle right now, but

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did you find that some of those lessons Maybe didn't

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apply or pieces of them applied and some didn't.

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In the wine business? Yeah. Coming from finance on the wine business.

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Well, it was not a conscious effort, more or less.

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It was more of a passion for me. It was more of a hobby for

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me. That's all. It started as a hobby a couple of years ago. The wine

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side. The wine side, Yeah. I mean I was, I'm an

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Armenian heritage

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ancestors and I'm originally from Iran.

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There's a big Armenian community, diaspora.

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I like my wife, yeah, we've been there for 500

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years and I've been in the US for about a little bit over 40

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years. And so for me

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it was more of whenever I went to Armenia. Recently I

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started going back to Armenia since 2011. That was my first time when

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visited in Armenia and I just loved the

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hospitality and the people and it was very welcoming

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and the food is amazing and the people are great.

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And for me it was like again coming home in a way,

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feeling that everybody speaks Armenian in the streets and such.

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And I tasted the authentic Armenian wine

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for the first time. When was that?

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2011, 2014 and

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16. And I went back six, seven times since then. But

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every time I went there, I tried this authentic Armenian wines

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and I'm like, oh, I wish I could find these also

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in the US and the US has great Armenian wines,

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needless to say, but there are always this micro wineries,

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mom and pop and family owned, but they don't get

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exposure. And I'm like, okay, well

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I'm going to take five bottles with me. That's the limit.

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If any friends come over from our event, hey, can you get me a couple

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of more bottles if not trouble. And

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that's how I got those wines. And

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slowly I was like, okay. Cork and bottle was a

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passion that I started and out of, not so

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much out of the business, but making money or anything like that behind

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it because I was already fine in my industry.

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It was more of I was trying to help a lot of business here. I've

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been always helping a lot of business owners here, startups, and watch them

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mature. And I want to take some of that passion and apply

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it to those winemakers and

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what product, what service that

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can I help in Armenia that is

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international, that brings joy to people,

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brings people together and that's all about what I like to do.

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I like to interact with people and have a seat and enjoy my time with

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them, talk great talks. And so wine

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goes back historically as a great product of

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Armenia and we, we are proud of it. How original.

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We are going back to 6,100 years. You know, let me stop it for a

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second. That. Sure. You said something important. And I, and

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I. That's the first time I've heard it said the way you said it, and

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I used it. Recently, I, I was asked to write a quote about,

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about food and wine. And I said, you know, historically,

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wine is probably the most

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historical reflection of culture there is.

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Because if you were to pick, if you were to pick five things that a

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culture might represent, you would say a language, which we have, you would say land,

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which we currently have, but you would say food would be a

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identifier of all cultures. And wine, if they have it,

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those are the things that represent a culture. And that's kind of interesting because

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you said it the same way. Yeah. And the wine is not

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perishable like the food is. Right. Okay. You can go to any country, enjoy the

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food and have an appetite, have that flavor of that

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fruit, that vegetable from that country. But you cannot bring in

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the US the same apple is not the same as apple here,

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but the essence, the juice from grape,

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what you get over here is transferable here. And it represents that

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same culture. Yeah. And it represents, and the wine

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has all the elements. It has the effect of the sun,

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the heat, the air, the water, the minerals. You get everything from

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that country, whether it's Armenia, Georgia,

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Hungary, France, Italy. But I'm

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proud to be, to be able to bring that flavors

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here in the US through the Coke and bottle. I was there in 07,

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and unless we just drank the wrong Armenian wines,

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nothing was palatable. And it's already been, you know, 1990 was

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freedom. Of course it takes, you know, wine is a very slow industry, so it

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takes years for technology to catch up and bring it in and bring winemakers

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that know what they're doing. Yes. And so if you're there 2011 or 14 and

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you're starting to taste things that feel like win wine, because the stuff I tasted

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didn't taste like wine. You know, that's a pretty amazing

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advancement in, in culture. And

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it goes back to the idea that really the Armenians

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were stalled during the Soviet time and

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so. And they got unleashed. Yes. And we've had this

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conversation before with many winemakers, but that was a fast

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release. I mean, they really ramped up. And I think some of the stuff I

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tasted with you and other wines that come from there are, can be

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or should be world class wines. So here you are

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organically helping your friends possibly get a bottle

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of Armenian wine because you Smuggled it in. So.

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But, but that's a lot different than like, okay, I'm going

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to start an LLC or subchapter s and I'm going to figure out how to

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get the logistics going. And I'm going to go back to Armenia and find some

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winemakers that want to be represented in the US and go through

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TTB approval. All that stuff. Yes. Were there things that you,

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that you didn't expect or there. All these things were just challenges

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because you've been in an industry that's very challenging anyway and you just, it regulated.

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Yes, it was just part of the game.

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And that's another aspect of my profession, my day job profession

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is being in this business of working with different industry

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people. And the 20 years in the business with, in

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finance and come across all these business owners with different lines of business.

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I had a lot of connection,

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people who knew people who are in industry.

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And when I asked them, and this is what my passion is and

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what I would love to do and

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graciously they offered, hey, let me introduce you to this person

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that imports wine from France. Let me introduce

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you to this person that imports wine from,

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that does logistics. Let me introduce you to this

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person. So that connection right there, I would have not been able

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to do as fast as what I did without that

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connection. So again, it wasn't so much about reading,

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going online and asked. It was more of

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people talking to people that are actually doing it or getting

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connected through people who are able to connect you with those people.

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So that is key and that has been the key for my

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success. I would love to say that to. This day, I

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can't imagine starting from with the Internet

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in Googling to figure out how to do this. Yeah, no, I mean almost

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impossible. And I've used consultants all these years.

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Everything I've had, you know, I've dabbled in all parts of the business and

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man, what a, you know, the headwinds must have been. Were they daunting

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where you're like, oh, I don't think I'm going to do this kind

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of thing. I was like, no. It's just, you know, again,

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it wasn't for me that, okay, I'm going to

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do this. And. Here it is.

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I'm dropping everything and I'm going to start the Coke and bottle

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imports. It was a process. It was okay, take one step at

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a time. I'm not going anywhere. I already have a

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day job. It pays the bills, feeds the family. I'm

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fine. This is a hobby and this is

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where My passion lies. And sometimes your passion,

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it just ignites and you get

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deeper and deeper. And as you said, wine industry is something

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that the more you learn, the more

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you realize that you don't know. Yeah,

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it keeps going and it's evolving, it's

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changing. Winemaking is not the same as

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even 2010

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or 500 years ago. So flavors change, palace

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change, people's priorities. Were you surprised when you got to

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Armenia, what you found? The quality of the wines, the variety

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of the wines, the philosophical approaches.

239
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And I was surprised about the varieties of the wine

240
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grapes that I never heard before. I mean, all

241
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of them. Never heard before. All of them. I mean, indigenous grapes. And that was.

242
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Even hybrids, which is really fascinating. Exactly. And for me,

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that is. That was a discovery of.

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It just opened me up to a whole new world. Because I love wine. I

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drank wine. I socialized a lot with friends and

246
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we drank wine. But, you know, I always like everyone else. You start with

247
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Merlot, Cabernets, Pinots, California wine, and

248
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evolving to other countries. But. And

249
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I appreciate it. I appreciate all those. And I

250
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thought, hey, why don't I appreciate the Armenian wines and see the

251
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Armenian grapes, what the varieties are. So every time I went there, little by little,

252
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I'm like, okay, what is this wine? And there are a lot of Armenian micro

253
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winery stores that are. There are great

254
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stores. And you sit down and you do wine tasting.

255
00:16:02,650 --> 00:16:05,810
And I'm like, oh, I love this, but it's not available. I love this, but

256
00:16:05,810 --> 00:16:08,650
it's not available, the brands. And

257
00:16:10,410 --> 00:16:14,250
so I would come back and I'm like, okay, just

258
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take it with you. Until. Another thing that

259
00:16:17,850 --> 00:16:21,050
motivated me was a friend of mine that

260
00:16:21,930 --> 00:16:25,420
he is opening up a store in Burbank,

261
00:16:25,740 --> 00:16:29,100
a wine store. And as you know, the

262
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US Wine import producing and import and

263
00:16:32,660 --> 00:16:35,820
distribution and sales is a tiered based. Yes.

264
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So when

265
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he said he's going to open up a store and I thought about it, I'm

266
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like, okay, so if you can open up the store, anything I bring,

267
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can you carry it? He's like, sure.

268
00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:55,680
Actually, let me stop there a second. Good friends,

269
00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:59,840
relatives, a certain extent, the Kasabians. Diko

270
00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:03,600
Kasabian has a little vineyard in his house in the Valley, and he

271
00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:06,880
now buys grapes and makes wines under the brand. And

272
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:10,960
when his wife went out to go sell, she went into a

273
00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:14,560
liquor store or wine shop in their part of town. And the guy said,

274
00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:17,240
you're my friend. I'm going to put the floor. I'm going to put the wine

275
00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,780
in. I give you a floor stack. Yeah, but it's not going to sell

276
00:17:21,580 --> 00:17:24,980
because no one's ever heard of it. Nobody walks in here looking for

277
00:17:24,980 --> 00:17:28,620
Kasabi and Vineyard Sauvignon Blanc. So it's your job.

278
00:17:29,260 --> 00:17:32,620
Meaning you. Yes. To go out and tell people that this exists.

279
00:17:32,860 --> 00:17:36,660
Yes. So that they come into my store or, you know, and

280
00:17:36,660 --> 00:17:40,340
this is a huge shift in the industry in California, for sure, and I'm sure

281
00:17:40,340 --> 00:17:43,020
the nation. But, you know, distributors,

282
00:17:44,470 --> 00:17:47,950
they'll take on a brand as long as it's being

283
00:17:47,950 --> 00:17:51,630
sold. They're not going to go build the brand for you anymore. So

284
00:17:51,630 --> 00:17:54,310
you. You have to go build the brand. Now, you're on both sides of the

285
00:17:54,310 --> 00:17:57,270
fence now because you are the distributor. Yeah. So you got to find somebody to

286
00:17:57,270 --> 00:18:00,630
build the brand. But the wine shop guy, now maybe in your case, as a

287
00:18:00,630 --> 00:18:03,830
friend, he'll hand sell the wine. Oh, by the way, come over to this section.

288
00:18:04,070 --> 00:18:07,230
You know, come over to Armand's section. We'll sell you one of our men's wines.

289
00:18:07,230 --> 00:18:11,030
But for the most part, it's kind of your job to tell people

290
00:18:11,030 --> 00:18:14,030
that this exists. Yeah. And that's why

291
00:18:15,150 --> 00:18:18,910
I'm not saying that. Okay. Just importing and put it in store, and that's

292
00:18:18,910 --> 00:18:22,150
it. My commitment is, when I speak with my

293
00:18:22,150 --> 00:18:25,870
producers is I'm putting. I'm going to put the effort into it.

294
00:18:25,870 --> 00:18:29,710
And I have. Starting from Guinea Fest, we

295
00:18:29,710 --> 00:18:33,430
had the sample tasting, and it was before even the product was landed

296
00:18:33,430 --> 00:18:37,250
in us. So those samples that you tasted, all. Those wines I tasted. Yes.

297
00:18:37,250 --> 00:18:41,050
They weren't here. They weren't here yet. They were the samples. Wow. I didn't. I

298
00:18:41,050 --> 00:18:44,090
didn't. I didn't know that. I didn't get the. I didn't get the actual product

299
00:18:44,170 --> 00:18:47,810
because. Because the shipment from Armenia takes about. It took me

300
00:18:47,810 --> 00:18:51,610
two and a half to three months to arrive in

301
00:18:51,610 --> 00:18:54,970
US from the port. This is an interesting problem. Let me stop you again. I'm

302
00:18:54,970 --> 00:18:58,810
sorry to interrupt. Yeah, sure. You're, You're, you're, you're touching on

303
00:18:58,810 --> 00:19:01,560
things that I had forgotten about or that I hadn't had to deal with for

304
00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:05,400
a long time. And one of those was I had an imports license.

305
00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:09,240
I have seven licenses still. Yeah, alcohol licenses. And I got them

306
00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:13,000
for all various reasons. My import license wasn't to bring. Bring wines in.

307
00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:16,720
It was to bring in other stuff, but I would never use it

308
00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:21,200
to import wine. Why? Because I wanted the importer

309
00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:25,080
to take the risk. Because there was. There was a risk, and there has

310
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:28,580
been, even from Europe, that what you ordered wasn't what you get

311
00:19:28,900 --> 00:19:32,660
for the listeners. This was not an uncommon. There was a whole

312
00:19:32,900 --> 00:19:36,260
issue years ago with the Italian wines that were filled with antifreeze kind of thing

313
00:19:36,340 --> 00:19:40,180
that they've been cut with antifreeze. But so I always relied on

314
00:19:40,180 --> 00:19:43,460
the importer. I love to pay them their cost per case

315
00:19:43,780 --> 00:19:47,340
or their clearing costs, knowing that when it landed in my

316
00:19:47,340 --> 00:19:50,620
warehouse, if it wasn't what I ordered, if what was in the bottle was not

317
00:19:50,620 --> 00:19:54,330
what I tasted. Yes. That I say, I'm not paying

318
00:19:54,330 --> 00:19:57,370
you. Take it back. And that happened four times in my career. So it's not

319
00:19:57,370 --> 00:20:01,050
a lot after 35 years. But were they what you

320
00:20:01,050 --> 00:20:04,530
ordered? Yes. All of them? Yes.

321
00:20:04,690 --> 00:20:07,850
Wow. They were. Because I did do

322
00:20:07,850 --> 00:20:11,450
diligence. Again, the idea was there, the

323
00:20:11,450 --> 00:20:14,450
passion is there, but again, you have to do what you have to do.

324
00:20:15,250 --> 00:20:18,760
So I went to Armenia myself when

325
00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:22,760
things got serious, where I had to choose the wines that I wanted

326
00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:26,080
to import. I interviewed, went to the

327
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:29,720
wineries, met all the family members, met the

328
00:20:30,360 --> 00:20:34,080
people behind the wine. Some of

329
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,440
them are four hours away, some of them are two hours away, some of them

330
00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:41,120
are one hour away. I sat in a taxi, they took me over there and

331
00:20:41,120 --> 00:20:44,880
I went, met, shook hands, looked the folks in their eyes

332
00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:48,710
and looked at the fields, and I said, okay, this is authentic. This

333
00:20:48,710 --> 00:20:52,030
is what it is. And they're serious. It's not like some. Some

334
00:20:52,190 --> 00:20:54,990
person putting wine together in the

335
00:20:56,030 --> 00:20:59,710
attic or. Or a room next door.

336
00:21:00,190 --> 00:21:03,470
So, no, I mean, I did do those diligence, due

337
00:21:03,470 --> 00:21:07,230
diligence. And. And they do. And these folks,

338
00:21:07,230 --> 00:21:10,830
these producers, they do want to get their wines out there.

339
00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:15,200
They're passionate about that wine. They're. They put their. I

340
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:18,840
mean, I'm working with a family, Maran family winery.

341
00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:22,520
They've been. That's been in their blood since

342
00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:27,560
1800. Pretty much the end of water wine. Right. What's that? They had

343
00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:31,000
the wine that they age underwater. I'm

344
00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:34,680
not sure. Modern, right?

345
00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:38,680
Modern winery? Yeah. Oh, yes, yes. They have the underwater one. Yeah.

346
00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:41,640
Right. Yes. He came to my.

347
00:21:42,710 --> 00:21:46,350
We did a dinner together or something for them in assembly. Yeah, they

348
00:21:46,350 --> 00:21:49,270
do. They store the bottles under the water? Yeah,

349
00:21:50,470 --> 00:21:54,230
certain time. Because I don't know much about that process,

350
00:21:54,230 --> 00:21:57,990
but apparently the water is around the

351
00:21:58,230 --> 00:22:01,870
wine, the temperature and everything it gives. I have a

352
00:22:01,870 --> 00:22:05,190
bottle at the house. I haven't opened it yet. Really? Yeah. I mean, it's very

353
00:22:05,670 --> 00:22:08,870
delicate. It's very interesting process, but really I.

354
00:22:09,550 --> 00:22:13,350
Since I could not import it because of the guidelines

355
00:22:13,350 --> 00:22:16,910
and requirement and compliance, because there are some standards for those

356
00:22:16,990 --> 00:22:20,630
type of wines. We could not. So.

357
00:22:20,630 --> 00:22:24,190
But, but yes, that's the family. But that's. I mean, that's a

358
00:22:24,430 --> 00:22:28,150
well known brand from this. So that was. For you to land that brand as

359
00:22:28,150 --> 00:22:31,870
a distributor is pretty. Yeah. And. And serious. Yes.

360
00:22:31,950 --> 00:22:35,230
They had a couple of lines here already for another importer, but

361
00:22:35,700 --> 00:22:39,500
I pretty much brought in the wider portfolio and. Which I'm bringing

362
00:22:39,500 --> 00:22:43,140
in as well. And it's been accepted very well. As a matter of fact,

363
00:22:43,540 --> 00:22:47,340
few of my wines. And you mentioned how do I promote

364
00:22:47,340 --> 00:22:51,060
it. And my commitment to my producer is like, listen, I take on

365
00:22:51,540 --> 00:22:55,180
promoting your products, putting the word out there about Armenian wines,

366
00:22:55,180 --> 00:22:58,820
Armenian grapes, and educate our folks,

367
00:22:59,060 --> 00:23:02,340
whether here in town or doing events or such.

368
00:23:02,980 --> 00:23:05,620
So in February, I attended

369
00:23:06,660 --> 00:23:10,180
Wine and Spirit Wholesalers America. Oh,

370
00:23:10,180 --> 00:23:14,020
wswa. Wswa, yes. They hate me. Back in

371
00:23:14,020 --> 00:23:17,780
the old days. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Because direct to consumer stuff was like circumventing the

372
00:23:17,780 --> 00:23:21,300
wholesalers of the world. So I attended that trade show in

373
00:23:21,300 --> 00:23:24,540
Colorado. So I went there, I

374
00:23:24,540 --> 00:23:26,420
promoted the wine

375
00:23:28,990 --> 00:23:32,830
and it was just a weekend or a

376
00:23:32,830 --> 00:23:36,110
weekend process. So it wasn't a big deal. It's just a very powerful

377
00:23:36,830 --> 00:23:40,470
organization. Yes. Just took a couple of days off, attended

378
00:23:40,470 --> 00:23:43,989
and came back next day, get back to work, day

379
00:23:43,989 --> 00:23:47,790
job. But that's what it was, you know.

380
00:23:47,790 --> 00:23:51,630
And my wines

381
00:23:51,630 --> 00:23:55,190
won awards. Our producers won award gold and silver awards

382
00:23:55,190 --> 00:23:58,510
at the competition. I don't remember that. They had some kind of

383
00:24:00,090 --> 00:24:03,770
tasting. They did. They had a panel. They did the tasting.

384
00:24:03,850 --> 00:24:07,530
And three of my wines won awards gold. And

385
00:24:07,530 --> 00:24:11,130
that feels pretty good, huh? If it made me a lot. It gave me a

386
00:24:11,130 --> 00:24:14,769
lot of confidence about our product, about our producers and the

387
00:24:14,769 --> 00:24:18,530
quality of wine you were talking about. Right. As a matter of

388
00:24:18,530 --> 00:24:21,930
fact, my wine is also one or my producer's wine

389
00:24:22,810 --> 00:24:26,180
via my importance cork and bottle import. They won also

390
00:24:26,420 --> 00:24:30,020
awards at the Los Angeles International Wine Company.

391
00:24:31,380 --> 00:24:34,980
The fair. The fair. Wow. That is. That is. Like I said, it's the

392
00:24:34,980 --> 00:24:38,500
largest. It was the largest independent tasting in the country. I don't know.

393
00:24:38,660 --> 00:24:42,340
So like 2500, 3000 wines. Yeah. So do you. We won

394
00:24:42,580 --> 00:24:46,300
awards as well. Congrats. That's really good. I'm gonna be

395
00:24:46,300 --> 00:24:49,940
there next week for some wine tasting

396
00:24:50,020 --> 00:24:53,340
at the fair. You know, in the old days, we used to set up

397
00:24:53,820 --> 00:24:56,780
this business. Really got started in

398
00:24:56,780 --> 00:25:00,060
1984. Yeah. Even though my dad was doing the 70s,

399
00:25:00,460 --> 00:25:04,300
it jumped in 1984. And I told you that it's because the LA.

400
00:25:04,620 --> 00:25:07,900
The LA County Fair called him. And they used to have a bill. It was

401
00:25:07,900 --> 00:25:11,500
Building four, which was the only Air conditioned building in the whole place back in

402
00:25:11,500 --> 00:25:15,140
the day. Yes. And it was all wine and county stuff,

403
00:25:15,140 --> 00:25:18,890
right? And they said, we, you know, my

404
00:25:18,890 --> 00:25:22,570
dad inquired maybe a month before the fair and they sell out the booths,

405
00:25:22,570 --> 00:25:26,410
you know, a year ahead. Anyway, he says they call him, if you can

406
00:25:26,570 --> 00:25:29,970
stock a 24, a 20 foot by 20 foot booth, like

407
00:25:29,970 --> 00:25:32,410
decorate it, you can have it for free.

408
00:25:33,690 --> 00:25:36,450
So he shows up with my mom, you know, they're 12 hour days to work

409
00:25:36,450 --> 00:25:40,170
those booths at the LA County Fair. He's right across from the tasting,

410
00:25:40,250 --> 00:25:43,970
the Gold Medal tasting bar. Oh, wow. Where you go and pay to

411
00:25:43,970 --> 00:25:47,770
what you're going to do when you go. And people saw the sign, Wine

412
00:25:47,770 --> 00:25:51,490
of the Month club. They signed up and he doubled his membership in 20 days.

413
00:25:51,810 --> 00:25:55,130
And he goes, wow, this is going to work. And here's. Here you are, show

414
00:25:55,130 --> 00:25:58,930
up at wwa, you win some awards, you go, hey, this might work. Yes. It's

415
00:25:58,930 --> 00:26:01,530
kind of like the way this industry is, because you don't know. How are you

416
00:26:01,530 --> 00:26:05,370
supposed to know? Exactly. So what's going on? I was at

417
00:26:05,370 --> 00:26:07,890
momad, I don't know if you know, moment. The restaurant. Oh, yeah, okay.

418
00:26:09,810 --> 00:26:12,820
And he and I was just there the other day and we were talking and

419
00:26:12,820 --> 00:26:16,300
he was, he was saying that his bottle sales

420
00:26:16,620 --> 00:26:20,420
of wine have gone down considerably, which is not unusual

421
00:26:20,420 --> 00:26:24,220
in the trade. Wine sales are down in general and here at the

422
00:26:24,220 --> 00:26:27,420
restaurant. And so he decided, and that's why I brought up partially as

423
00:26:28,140 --> 00:26:31,260
something for you to go pursue as well as just the idea, the concept of

424
00:26:31,260 --> 00:26:34,900
what he's doing. He's, he's Mediterranean food, but kind of

425
00:26:34,900 --> 00:26:38,720
not sort of. He's just a nice fusion of Mediterranean flavors

426
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:42,560
in his food. And he's redoing his whole wine list and he's

427
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:46,320
going to go all Mediterranean. He's getting rid of all the standards. He's getting

428
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,280
rid of the Austin Hopes and the Silver Oaks and the Cuses, all that stuff

429
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:52,240
going. And his whole list is going to be strictly

430
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:56,320
probably some of your wines, hopefully of wines from, from

431
00:26:56,320 --> 00:27:00,160
Armenia, maybe some from Lebanon, who knows? Yes. And I thought. Have you

432
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:03,440
seen the questions? Have you seen this kind of

433
00:27:04,830 --> 00:27:08,350
sweeping move for wines of unusual

434
00:27:08,350 --> 00:27:11,590
places? I mean, here you are, you're on the streets now trying to sell some

435
00:27:11,590 --> 00:27:15,310
stuff. And what's the, let's go back a little bit. What's the general

436
00:27:15,390 --> 00:27:18,030
comment you get if you walk into Total Wine?

437
00:27:20,750 --> 00:27:22,590
Are you crazy or are you.

438
00:27:24,510 --> 00:27:28,270
No, I mean, I've been interesting. I mean, I've been very fortunate

439
00:27:28,270 --> 00:27:31,760
to come across very Positive feedback

440
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:36,080
from wine tasters or those in the

441
00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:39,720
industry or those folks that are decision makers for

442
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:43,280
the stores that they carry my wine or they will carry my wine.

443
00:27:45,360 --> 00:27:49,040
The most positive feedback is an order. Yes. Right. Yes. And

444
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:52,760
also it's an order. But again, they do the tasting. They're

445
00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:56,520
like, hey, this is unique. This is different. What is

446
00:27:56,520 --> 00:28:00,300
this kind of grape? Is this. Just educate them a little bit about

447
00:28:00,300 --> 00:28:04,020
that, and they decide to carry

448
00:28:04,020 --> 00:28:07,020
it and put it in part of their international wine

449
00:28:07,740 --> 00:28:11,580
shelves. And again, that gives me

450
00:28:11,580 --> 00:28:15,300
very good feeling to know that I'm the

451
00:28:15,300 --> 00:28:19,100
first one having an Armenian wine in that store. Yeah, that's

452
00:28:19,100 --> 00:28:22,780
huge. I mean, I'm really impressed with that, being able to do. How about

453
00:28:22,780 --> 00:28:25,780
getting those appointments in the first place? Word of mouth,

454
00:28:26,340 --> 00:28:29,140
doing events like what I did events like that

455
00:28:30,020 --> 00:28:33,060
yesterday. Last Thursday, I was at

456
00:28:33,540 --> 00:28:36,420
Glendale Business Summit.

457
00:28:37,860 --> 00:28:41,620
There was a great turnout of business owners in Glendale and

458
00:28:41,620 --> 00:28:45,460
at a table giving out samples. And

459
00:28:45,860 --> 00:28:49,140
it was amazing event. Very good event and very good

460
00:28:49,140 --> 00:28:52,560
turnout and people. My table was the

461
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:56,160
busiest table. Obviously, bring. Yeah.

462
00:28:56,720 --> 00:29:00,440
Wine brings people together. I think you've learned that part about the wine business.

463
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,840
Right, Right. And that was. That was great to see that.

464
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,760
And again, very good feedback. Very interested

465
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:11,200
people. And a lot of people were like, wow, what is this? What is this

466
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,920
different grape? And because those. It's not your. With all the

467
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,680
respect. It's not your Cabernets. It's not your Chardonnays. It's just

468
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:22,450
different grape. And it's just like you're trying the first time, I don't know,

469
00:29:22,450 --> 00:29:26,090
Sushi, your first time, you're trying Thai food or. Yeah. So it's just a

470
00:29:26,090 --> 00:29:29,810
different palette, and that's what I compare it to. That's interesting.

471
00:29:29,890 --> 00:29:33,730
What. I had this question the other day, and it's. It's not. It's not an

472
00:29:33,730 --> 00:29:37,530
easy question, because describing wines,

473
00:29:37,530 --> 00:29:41,330
you know, it's very subjective to the set of, you may sense,

474
00:29:41,410 --> 00:29:45,050
you know, fennel and I may not, or you may sense raspberries, and I may

475
00:29:45,050 --> 00:29:48,540
not. So that's that part. When people say wine's subjective. I don't think

476
00:29:48,940 --> 00:29:52,540
the evaluation of good wine is subjective, because good wine is good wine. And I

477
00:29:52,540 --> 00:29:56,260
think everybody recognizes it. It's the character, you know, it's like

478
00:29:56,260 --> 00:30:00,020
trying to describe it. And so somebody always asks, well, what is Ottomany like?

479
00:30:00,020 --> 00:30:03,340
Is it like Pinot Noir? Is it like Syrah? What's it like? And that's a

480
00:30:03,340 --> 00:30:07,180
tough question. And I always say it is actually light in structure,

481
00:30:07,740 --> 00:30:11,500
like Pinot Noir, but it's big in flavor, like a Zin or

482
00:30:11,500 --> 00:30:15,070
Syrah word. There's, you know, even though it looks light in the glass,

483
00:30:15,630 --> 00:30:19,230
it's got some backbone to it. Yeah. And so do you. Do you.

484
00:30:19,230 --> 00:30:22,830
Do people respect that when you. When you first taste them, they've never

485
00:30:22,830 --> 00:30:26,430
tasted this variety before. Yeah. And they kind of go,

486
00:30:26,430 --> 00:30:30,270
whoa. I've never had this. Like, last night, I opened a tannat from my

487
00:30:30,270 --> 00:30:33,790
wife, and she. She's a Bordeaux person. Open a tannat, she goes, this is different.

488
00:30:34,750 --> 00:30:38,550
Yes. I mean, people like to say different. It's

489
00:30:38,550 --> 00:30:42,260
different now. Different. Interesting. Interesting. Interesting

490
00:30:42,260 --> 00:30:46,020
good or interesting bad? I hope Interesting good. But when they say, can I

491
00:30:46,020 --> 00:30:49,580
have the second sip? I'm like, I think it's an interesting good. Can I. Can

492
00:30:49,580 --> 00:30:51,980
they come back for the third sip? Yeah, that makes sense. I'm like, I think

493
00:30:51,980 --> 00:30:55,620
this is really good. I'll buy that. So

494
00:30:55,620 --> 00:30:59,060
I just go based on that, you know? And there's so much you can explain

495
00:30:59,060 --> 00:31:02,820
about the wine and the flavors and the background of

496
00:31:02,820 --> 00:31:06,620
the grapes and the historic significance of it and where the

497
00:31:06,620 --> 00:31:10,140
RNA comes from and what is compared to.

498
00:31:10,380 --> 00:31:13,820
Comparison to, as you mentioned, Pinot Noir, Zinfandel, and.

499
00:31:14,140 --> 00:31:17,140
But again, at the end of the day is like, you have to try it.

500
00:31:17,140 --> 00:31:19,020
You have to experience it, because

501
00:31:20,620 --> 00:31:24,220
you. You don't know until you don't know what. You don't know

502
00:31:24,300 --> 00:31:27,660
until you try it, and then you realize, oh, this is a whole new

503
00:31:29,100 --> 00:31:32,860
world that you just opened up for me. Now, today could be

504
00:31:33,180 --> 00:31:34,780
RNA made by,

505
00:31:37,220 --> 00:31:40,980
let's say, Crows Rock or Maran or Gerani

506
00:31:40,980 --> 00:31:44,340
or such. Tomorrow could be, let me try

507
00:31:45,780 --> 00:31:48,500
Voskevas grape. You know, let me try

508
00:31:49,460 --> 00:31:52,500
Garas. So

509
00:31:53,460 --> 00:31:57,140
it's the same grape, different producers, and each one has its

510
00:31:57,140 --> 00:32:00,780
own expertise. And for me,

511
00:32:00,780 --> 00:32:04,590
just. For me to be able to introduce R and E grape or

512
00:32:04,590 --> 00:32:08,390
Kangun grape or a Hafta nut grape for the first time to

513
00:32:08,390 --> 00:32:11,990
Paul, and then Paul's gonna try something else with the same

514
00:32:11,990 --> 00:32:15,710
grape but somebody else's brand. For me, that's still a very

515
00:32:15,710 --> 00:32:18,310
good feeling because, again, it opens up a different

516
00:32:19,910 --> 00:32:22,470
area of

517
00:32:23,510 --> 00:32:27,230
exposing and introducing indigenous Armenian grapes.

518
00:32:27,230 --> 00:32:30,790
You kind of. You answered a question I didn't even ask. You're pretty good at

519
00:32:30,790 --> 00:32:34,630
this, huh? It's just the flow, I

520
00:32:34,630 --> 00:32:38,030
guess. Sorry. No, it's not. It's very funny, because

521
00:32:38,510 --> 00:32:41,430
just look at that picture right there. There was probably a bottle on the wall

522
00:32:41,430 --> 00:32:44,990
back then. It was called Hickory Ridge. And that would

523
00:32:44,990 --> 00:32:48,750
certainly lend you to believe that it's a wine from America, and it was

524
00:32:48,750 --> 00:32:51,310
moldavian and so what they were trying. And they didn't put the name of the

525
00:32:51,310 --> 00:32:55,030
grape on it, it was a Moldavian grape. Because they, they did, they were trying

526
00:32:55,030 --> 00:32:58,110
to introduce the wine to America and Americans wouldn't understand this.

527
00:32:59,210 --> 00:33:02,490
And so that's a conversation that goes on in every region of the world.

528
00:33:02,810 --> 00:33:06,090
The French did it a long time ago. Instead of putting

529
00:33:07,050 --> 00:33:09,930
bon the label, they put Chardonnay so that

530
00:33:10,330 --> 00:33:14,130
Americans would understand it. Yeah. So the question is, does this lead

531
00:33:14,130 --> 00:33:17,890
to, do we put otany because we're proud Armenians of

532
00:33:17,890 --> 00:33:20,970
our culture, we put otany in Kangun and Volskahat and

533
00:33:21,370 --> 00:33:25,220
Hagtaman and all that stuff on the label, or do we give

534
00:33:25,220 --> 00:33:29,020
it some fanciful name so that people might see it on the

535
00:33:29,020 --> 00:33:32,580
shelf and go, oh, there's a, you know, Chateau Armand. And,

536
00:33:32,740 --> 00:33:36,580
and, but you. Sounds like to me. And the reason you said that you answered

537
00:33:36,580 --> 00:33:40,180
the question already was, yeah, we're going to talk about irony and we're going to

538
00:33:40,180 --> 00:33:44,020
expose the world to this grape. Yeah. So my brother in law

539
00:33:44,020 --> 00:33:47,500
came home from Armenia way back when, probably 20 years ago or 15 years ago,

540
00:33:47,500 --> 00:33:51,260
and he says, we got to bring Adeni to Army to America. The grape

541
00:33:51,260 --> 00:33:55,020
itself, grow it here. Which as you know, you can't just transplant grapes and

542
00:33:55,020 --> 00:33:58,820
expect them to flourish. But yeah, my first reaction was

543
00:33:58,820 --> 00:34:02,380
then, having been in this business for so long, was no one's going to understand

544
00:34:02,380 --> 00:34:04,980
what out any is. No one's going to buy out any. Why would you walk

545
00:34:04,980 --> 00:34:07,980
into, no one walks into the store and says, do you have any Voska Hut?

546
00:34:08,859 --> 00:34:12,500
Is this some sort of the challenge that you, that you've taken on yourself to

547
00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:16,260
say, yeah, we, we have these things and they're really good. Well, you have

548
00:34:16,260 --> 00:34:19,940
to, if, I mean, I don't want to sit back and say that we have

549
00:34:19,940 --> 00:34:23,090
to do it and have, you know, rely on Paul to do it.

550
00:34:23,570 --> 00:34:27,250
If I can do it, I'll do it myself. Yeah. And if I

551
00:34:27,250 --> 00:34:30,810
have to be the first person, let it be the first person who's gonna do

552
00:34:30,810 --> 00:34:34,530
this. I mean, the rewards or

553
00:34:34,530 --> 00:34:38,330
failure. Try. I mean, you gotta

554
00:34:38,330 --> 00:34:42,010
try. You gotta try. And again,

555
00:34:42,010 --> 00:34:45,730
it's just, I mean, it's after, at the end of the day, it's

556
00:34:45,730 --> 00:34:49,300
wine, it

557
00:34:49,300 --> 00:34:51,860
doesn't sell. You just open it up and drink it. Yeah. Every time you do

558
00:34:51,860 --> 00:34:55,620
these podcasts, I feel like I need a glass of wine. You know, like when

559
00:34:55,620 --> 00:34:59,420
I go home, like I'm already anticipating going home. And I, I happen to be

560
00:34:59,420 --> 00:35:03,180
a big fan of the Voskavas, Adeni and I Can't wait to open it. Yeah.

561
00:35:03,180 --> 00:35:05,900
But here's. Here's the interesting thing and I get a lot of pushback on this.

562
00:35:06,220 --> 00:35:09,900
I don't think personally, Adeni, the grape

563
00:35:09,900 --> 00:35:13,360
likes oak. I think that the Armenian trade

564
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,960
had decided that the French do it and Americans do it and so we should

565
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:20,480
do it. And I think it throws out any out of balance. I think Sydney

566
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:23,560
likes oak. I think it does really well with oak, but I don't think oddity

567
00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:26,720
does or I haven't tasted an oak age ottomy that was

568
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:30,160
balanced properly with the oak. Yes. You have an opinion on that?

569
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:35,520
I haven't tasted that many, to be honest with you. I'm not

570
00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:37,440
a psalm. I'm not a.

571
00:35:40,380 --> 00:35:44,140
To feel like oak where the oak. Yeah. I mean, for me,

572
00:35:44,140 --> 00:35:47,980
when I did the tasting myself, when I tried it, I tried a few. With

573
00:35:47,980 --> 00:35:51,740
few friends as well, that they had a little bit more expertise

574
00:35:52,140 --> 00:35:55,740
and we just went with our gut feeling. I went with my God feeling. And

575
00:35:55,740 --> 00:35:59,460
you know what? So far since I've been working, it's been working. Well,

576
00:35:59,460 --> 00:36:02,580
then I want you to tuck that information under your hat that you're wearing. I

577
00:36:02,580 --> 00:36:06,020
will. And. And when you go to army in X or you taste the wine

578
00:36:06,020 --> 00:36:09,530
X, you just mark my words that I think

579
00:36:09,530 --> 00:36:13,010
Adony in its organic and biodynamic form.

580
00:36:13,010 --> 00:36:16,690
Yes. Is a pretty interesting grape in its oak form

581
00:36:16,850 --> 00:36:20,610
is just red wine. Yeah. I mean I

582
00:36:20,610 --> 00:36:24,290
have a couple of wines that are in oak.

583
00:36:24,290 --> 00:36:27,730
Are any in oaks or there are some still

584
00:36:27,730 --> 00:36:31,410
casks. Do you have Amphora? Do you have some

585
00:36:31,730 --> 00:36:35,330
Amphora? Amphora? No, I don't have one Amphora yet.

586
00:36:37,030 --> 00:36:40,550
So that's something to work on, expanding my portfolio.

587
00:36:40,870 --> 00:36:44,310
So right now I'm a very small. Again, I'm a very small producer,

588
00:36:44,470 --> 00:36:48,310
not producer, sorry, importer, compared to other importers, Armenian wine importers

589
00:36:48,310 --> 00:36:50,910
in the industry. But you have a pretty big book. I mean you must have

590
00:36:50,910 --> 00:36:54,670
20, 25 SKUs in there. I do have 20, yes. I have

591
00:36:54,670 --> 00:36:57,270
20 SKUs. Correct.

592
00:36:59,590 --> 00:37:03,430
And you know, as a first time importer, you bring

593
00:37:03,430 --> 00:37:06,170
it in and. And there are some that

594
00:37:07,050 --> 00:37:10,810
are expected or accepted in the

595
00:37:10,810 --> 00:37:14,330
new world here and there are some that takes a little bit more work.

596
00:37:15,450 --> 00:37:19,130
So I'm still in that process of learning. But again,

597
00:37:19,610 --> 00:37:23,370
something that maybe was not palatable for some

598
00:37:23,370 --> 00:37:27,210
folks. Some other restaurants, some loved it

599
00:37:28,170 --> 00:37:31,400
and they ordered it for their restaurant. But

600
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:36,000
in up Fresno area. But then. But they

601
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:38,840
were not so much palatable here.

602
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:43,400
So that would be normal. It's normal, you know. So again,

603
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,960
no rush for me. Again this is. I'm doing it as

604
00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:51,400
a. It's fun. It's serious, but it's fun. And

605
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:56,160
so I'm not worrying about those things. Something interesting about new

606
00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:59,840
world, old world. You know, this. I love this part of the wine

607
00:37:59,920 --> 00:38:03,680
trade for Armenia. And I. I go to a lot of

608
00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:06,520
tastings. I still go to many. And the one I do like to go to

609
00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:10,360
is called Raw R. A W is put on by a

610
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:14,120
master of wine out of the uk. She's a French woman, but she

611
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:17,880
has a group of wineries that follow certain. It's not a certification. It's

612
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:21,360
not a. It's not like biodynamic organic, but it's wines that are, you know, quote

613
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:25,080
unquote, natural. And you do have to have certain processes in

614
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:28,150
place in order to. Part of her group. And she'd put you on the road.

615
00:38:28,390 --> 00:38:31,990
You go to all these different parts of the country. They do five in America

616
00:38:32,390 --> 00:38:36,190
and. And usually it's downtown. It's every year. And

617
00:38:36,190 --> 00:38:39,510
I went to the Georgian booth. Okay, okay. And they were.

618
00:38:40,390 --> 00:38:43,430
Well, they were. There wasn't really a booth. There's like three or four Georgian whiners

619
00:38:43,430 --> 00:38:46,790
in a row. And clearly this old world

620
00:38:47,430 --> 00:38:51,030
man, you know, old tennis shoe type wines in one

621
00:38:51,190 --> 00:38:54,790
table, and then you go to the next table. And there's a modern take on

622
00:38:54,790 --> 00:38:58,430
the same grapes. And they have very specific grapes as well. They use M4. They

623
00:38:58,430 --> 00:39:01,710
have all kinds of amazing techniques. And I thought,

624
00:39:02,110 --> 00:39:05,950
well, Armenia is in this really weird definition of old world. If you

625
00:39:05,950 --> 00:39:09,510
were to talk about the world old world, you would either talk about it as

626
00:39:09,510 --> 00:39:13,230
a function of character, which is that old tennis shoe flavor,

627
00:39:13,630 --> 00:39:17,350
or you would talk about it as ground like

628
00:39:17,350 --> 00:39:20,510
Burgundy, which has been making wines since, you know, the 10th century.

629
00:39:21,260 --> 00:39:24,860
So using both those definitions, army is sort of a tough spot

630
00:39:24,860 --> 00:39:28,460
because it has to be old world that way. But it

631
00:39:28,620 --> 00:39:32,460
was stalled in technology for 70 years. And

632
00:39:32,460 --> 00:39:35,380
now we are really a new world in the way we make wine for the

633
00:39:35,380 --> 00:39:38,700
most part, stainless steel fermentation. And, you know, we're working,

634
00:39:38,780 --> 00:39:42,420
experimenting things. But what you. What we don't have, and this was

635
00:39:42,420 --> 00:39:46,140
brought to me by Amy Kashkarian of Zulau, which

636
00:39:46,140 --> 00:39:49,950
was. We don't have the 200 years experience. We

637
00:39:49,950 --> 00:39:52,750
missed out on that experience. To learn about Adoni

638
00:39:53,550 --> 00:39:56,750
Adeni and Adeni, to learn about Sileni in

639
00:39:56,750 --> 00:40:00,350
Artsakh, to learn about what Voskahat does

640
00:40:01,230 --> 00:40:04,430
near Yerevan when it's growing. We don't have all that experience yet.

641
00:40:06,510 --> 00:40:09,830
What would you say if somebody says that? Well, are you Old world or new

642
00:40:09,830 --> 00:40:13,660
world? Little bit of both. Little. Both.

643
00:40:13,660 --> 00:40:17,420
Yeah. That's good. We can always say

644
00:40:17,420 --> 00:40:20,780
historically, we go back to 6,100 years based on the

645
00:40:20,780 --> 00:40:24,220
archaeologic find, archaeologist findings,

646
00:40:24,540 --> 00:40:28,340
the Arini Cave and all the winemaking. Yes,

647
00:40:28,340 --> 00:40:32,140
but to your point, it's not like we've been making wine

648
00:40:32,140 --> 00:40:35,740
since then. I mean, again, us as the first

649
00:40:35,740 --> 00:40:39,470
Christian nation in 300 BC, you know, and part

650
00:40:39,470 --> 00:40:43,190
of being Christian, you know, wine comes with it, right? That's true. Part of

651
00:40:43,190 --> 00:40:46,230
our tradition. So again, winemaking in our

652
00:40:46,710 --> 00:40:50,430
nationality is. It's within our blood that it's part

653
00:40:50,430 --> 00:40:53,510
of our culture, it's part of our religion. So

654
00:40:55,910 --> 00:40:59,550
although all this technology is new, but maybe

655
00:40:59,550 --> 00:41:01,990
it's been broken since Soviet Union.

656
00:41:03,430 --> 00:41:07,280
We joined Soviet Union, all that. But again, it's been

657
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:11,480
in our culture, it's been in our

658
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:15,200
heritage. So it's easier for us to come back to

659
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:17,360
it and delve deep and

660
00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:22,400
reignite the passion. And the rne grape, it's historically

661
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:24,480
one of the oldest grapes as well.

662
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:30,720
That's what I think. Kind of old and new. We just.

663
00:41:31,740 --> 00:41:34,300
But to your point, yes, winemaking in Armenia,

664
00:41:35,260 --> 00:41:39,020
it's picked up only the last 15 years and

665
00:41:39,180 --> 00:41:42,780
grew very much. But

666
00:41:43,180 --> 00:41:46,980
they've been there, they've been making wine. There are wineries that's

667
00:41:46,980 --> 00:41:49,900
been around 20 years, 30 years,

668
00:41:52,380 --> 00:41:56,180
but past five years we really grew. There's a

669
00:41:56,180 --> 00:41:59,730
lot of Armenian winemakers, which. In itself is really impressive that

670
00:41:59,730 --> 00:42:03,530
they've able to create quality like they have in such a

671
00:42:03,530 --> 00:42:07,250
short amount of time. That's a interesting definition and I guess this

672
00:42:07,250 --> 00:42:10,970
is generational, that every generation goes through their opinion of anything,

673
00:42:10,970 --> 00:42:14,330
whether it's wine or food, it doesn't matter. You know,

674
00:42:14,810 --> 00:42:18,410
now the fact that, for instance, with cuisine, we're into a mode of

675
00:42:18,410 --> 00:42:22,130
healthy eating and, and non frozen and all the

676
00:42:22,130 --> 00:42:25,700
things that go into making quality food, when only in the

677
00:42:25,700 --> 00:42:29,500
60s and 70s was it more appropriate to

678
00:42:29,500 --> 00:42:32,780
have fake stuff in your food and to have frozen steaks and all. I mean,

679
00:42:32,780 --> 00:42:36,300
that was just the culture, you know, the packaged foods. And we were fed that

680
00:42:36,300 --> 00:42:39,340
and we were, we ate that. And so I think wine goes through the same

681
00:42:39,340 --> 00:42:42,980
thing. But for me, what's interesting about wine, it still is what

682
00:42:42,980 --> 00:42:46,540
Noah made. Right. It's still fermented grape

683
00:42:46,540 --> 00:42:49,780
juice. Yes. You know, all the cycles of

684
00:42:49,860 --> 00:42:53,700
consumerism can change the profile of the wine. And now we're into

685
00:42:53,780 --> 00:42:56,980
a cleaner, brighter wines than we used to be, even 10 years ago.

686
00:42:57,460 --> 00:43:01,140
But still it's the same as it was. Yes. And

687
00:43:01,220 --> 00:43:04,580
I think that's And I'm wondering too, do you come across

688
00:43:05,860 --> 00:43:09,660
since. And I think this is important because it's

689
00:43:09,660 --> 00:43:12,340
so new and because we don't have

690
00:43:13,060 --> 00:43:16,620
fields contaminated with pesticides and herbicides and

691
00:43:16,620 --> 00:43:19,990
insecticides. Yes. Do you think it's a natural

692
00:43:20,390 --> 00:43:23,950
transition for Armenian wines to be at least organic, if not

693
00:43:23,950 --> 00:43:27,110
biodynamic? And do you have a call for them? Do people ask about that?

694
00:43:28,310 --> 00:43:31,990
No, but what I think is at least

695
00:43:31,990 --> 00:43:35,550
those that I work with, I try to work

696
00:43:35,550 --> 00:43:39,030
with the wineries that are least.

697
00:43:40,950 --> 00:43:43,350
Intervention. Yes. So.

698
00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:48,120
That'S where I like to work with because again,

699
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:54,240
we're not dealing with. I'm not dealing with quantities that they

700
00:43:54,240 --> 00:43:57,960
make. The largest producer is that I

701
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:00,760
work with is Vosquevas. Yeah,

702
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:05,000
they make a lot of wines. But again I. My wine within

703
00:44:05,240 --> 00:44:08,920
their company is smaller line.

704
00:44:10,050 --> 00:44:13,730
They don't make that many. Yeah, but majority of my other,

705
00:44:14,290 --> 00:44:18,010
the other five that I. Five other producers

706
00:44:18,010 --> 00:44:21,850
I represent, they are small, they don't make that many

707
00:44:21,850 --> 00:44:25,529
batches, that many bottles. So what I get is what

708
00:44:25,529 --> 00:44:27,650
I get and that's it.

709
00:44:29,410 --> 00:44:32,770
So that for me, that's very special. Again,

710
00:44:33,170 --> 00:44:36,970
if I have my wine on your shelf, I don't try to make

711
00:44:36,970 --> 00:44:40,770
it big and all across send, I don't

712
00:44:40,770 --> 00:44:44,530
know, 500 cases to Total Wines and all

713
00:44:45,010 --> 00:44:48,210
250 stores. No, that's not my intention.

714
00:44:48,770 --> 00:44:52,569
You know, if I can have it in one location, that's fine, that's.

715
00:44:52,569 --> 00:44:56,290
I'm content with that. And it doesn't also with my business model,

716
00:44:56,290 --> 00:44:59,330
I can't because that requires capital

717
00:45:00,290 --> 00:45:03,570
coming from finance. So that requires capital and that

718
00:45:03,570 --> 00:45:06,500
requires extra work and

719
00:45:07,860 --> 00:45:11,140
to have capital and investors.

720
00:45:13,460 --> 00:45:17,260
I'm responsible for the investors and I don't want to be responsible for

721
00:45:17,260 --> 00:45:20,940
that. This is all self funded, by the way. I didn't borrow any money

722
00:45:20,940 --> 00:45:24,740
from anyone in my business because I wanted it to be

723
00:45:25,220 --> 00:45:29,060
my way, my project. And I don't want to answer to

724
00:45:29,060 --> 00:45:32,900
anyone. It's like it's. I answer to myself.

725
00:45:33,540 --> 00:45:37,380
That's a very Armenian thing to do. I agree

726
00:45:37,380 --> 00:45:40,980
with you. That's. I could never do it the other way as well. Yeah, you

727
00:45:40,980 --> 00:45:44,740
want to carve your own path. At one point maybe you have

728
00:45:44,740 --> 00:45:48,580
to because you scale. But at that point

729
00:45:48,980 --> 00:45:52,220
I'll be confident enough to say, hey, these are what I've done in the past

730
00:45:52,220 --> 00:45:55,860
four or five years on my own. Yeah, right. This is the past,

731
00:45:55,860 --> 00:45:59,220
this is the present and this is what I envision for the next 10 years.

732
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:03,200
And that's where I can confidently say,

733
00:46:03,280 --> 00:46:06,320
okay, now I'm accepting

734
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:10,000
Capital or investment. But again,

735
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:14,400
it's something that I'm not thinking about. I just like to take it day by

736
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:17,520
day, month by month in the. Cycle of what you're doing.

737
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:21,520
You've got your obviously organization established, you've got a

738
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:25,160
logistical thing. You're making sales calls, you're exposing the

739
00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:28,860
brands that at different trade events so that people can

740
00:46:28,860 --> 00:46:31,140
see what you're doing and have a chance to buy them.

741
00:46:32,580 --> 00:46:35,780
Have you thought about the next step, what that's going to be? More brands,

742
00:46:36,500 --> 00:46:39,620
more diverse type of brands. A salesperson.

743
00:46:41,460 --> 00:46:45,140
I'm not there yet. I'm trying to do myself

744
00:46:45,380 --> 00:46:48,940
a little bit of again from my past

745
00:46:48,940 --> 00:46:52,260
experience where I've been doing, I've been knocking on doors,

746
00:46:53,390 --> 00:46:57,070
boots on the ground, walk inside a business and say, hi,

747
00:46:57,070 --> 00:47:00,510
I'm here. Would you like to buy this?

748
00:47:02,430 --> 00:47:05,550
So I'm not shy in that. So

749
00:47:06,190 --> 00:47:09,550
that's what I'm doing. That's what I've been doing. It's been successful

750
00:47:10,270 --> 00:47:13,910
and I want to first experience it

751
00:47:13,910 --> 00:47:17,710
myself before I hire a salesperson and try to coach

752
00:47:17,710 --> 00:47:21,530
them in the industry. So. And I don't want

753
00:47:21,690 --> 00:47:25,450
anyone to come in with their preconceived sales system

754
00:47:25,610 --> 00:47:29,370
because, you know, salesperson is a

755
00:47:29,370 --> 00:47:33,130
salesperson. My focus is not selling my focus right

756
00:47:33,130 --> 00:47:36,970
now, it's educating. Well, I think it's interesting you said that.

757
00:47:37,770 --> 00:47:40,970
The way I did it here for 35 years and how I got

758
00:47:40,970 --> 00:47:44,730
100,000 wines under my belt I've tasted is because every

759
00:47:44,730 --> 00:47:48,550
Tuesday for 35 years, ever since those days, in fact, in that picture, I'd

760
00:47:48,550 --> 00:47:51,870
go upstairs, I set up my dad's Tuesday's tasting with his doctor friend.

761
00:47:53,150 --> 00:47:56,190
I just went to the tasting room, stood there at 9 o' clock in the

762
00:47:56,190 --> 00:47:58,870
morning and I left at 2 o' clock and I tasted whatever came in the

763
00:47:58,870 --> 00:48:02,590
door. Yes. And the reason I brought that up was I would get all kinds

764
00:48:02,590 --> 00:48:06,390
of stories of the previous call that that sales rep made or

765
00:48:06,390 --> 00:48:09,790
the previous presentation or the jerk

766
00:48:10,190 --> 00:48:13,990
restaurateur who made them wait two hours to taste one wine and then insult

767
00:48:13,990 --> 00:48:17,760
them. You know, there, there is no formula. Right. I think education

768
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:22,200
is probably the only formula. And not, not wine. Geeky

769
00:48:22,200 --> 00:48:25,960
information. But you know, the. Your job is to supplement and

770
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:29,600
help this retailer or this restaurant sell some stuff. Exactly. The first

771
00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:32,520
job. It has to. It is about business. Right. We have to make a buck.

772
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:36,360
Yeah. Or a drum or two. Right. So you can't, you

773
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:40,160
can't just ignore that. Yeah. And. But the stories I

774
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:43,310
used to hear about some of these, the way People were treated was like

775
00:48:43,310 --> 00:48:46,990
unbelievable. Well, one of the responsibilities I have as

776
00:48:46,990 --> 00:48:50,430
well is to small. To help the small businesses here.

777
00:48:50,430 --> 00:48:54,030
Yeah. So I'm not here to import my

778
00:48:54,030 --> 00:48:57,870
products, just to import it, sell it to Paul

779
00:48:57,950 --> 00:49:01,550
to put it on the shelf. Here I am. I make the money, I walk

780
00:49:01,550 --> 00:49:04,830
away. Right. No, my focus is

781
00:49:05,230 --> 00:49:08,750
to have it on your shelf, to make sure that it's a good enough

782
00:49:08,750 --> 00:49:12,470
product, that I support you enough that you gonna

783
00:49:12,470 --> 00:49:16,310
sell this product and educate your clients about why this wine

784
00:49:16,310 --> 00:49:20,030
is a little bit special than the others or why

785
00:49:20,030 --> 00:49:23,470
they should buy this wine compared these grapes compared to these

786
00:49:23,710 --> 00:49:27,390
other grapes. So I think it's. My

787
00:49:27,390 --> 00:49:31,070
focus is, my business model is to make it a win, win,

788
00:49:31,070 --> 00:49:34,670
win situation. Win for my producer, win for my

789
00:49:34,910 --> 00:49:38,190
store owner, and win for my, the their

790
00:49:38,190 --> 00:49:41,310
vendors. And here I am the importer and

791
00:49:41,310 --> 00:49:44,950
wholesaler. Naturally, I'm going to be the winner anyways. Yeah.

792
00:49:44,950 --> 00:49:48,110
Right. Well, it's an important feature. That's an important comment, though.

793
00:49:49,710 --> 00:49:52,630
I, I made this comment at the Armenian assembly event. The one, the one where

794
00:49:52,630 --> 00:49:55,710
I had the. Yes.

795
00:49:56,670 --> 00:50:00,030
And there was an interesting thing right there. I had the. They had two Volska

796
00:50:00,030 --> 00:50:03,470
hearts that day. One was Voskavaz and the other one was

797
00:50:03,940 --> 00:50:07,740
the Moran. And they were entirely different wines. Yes.

798
00:50:07,740 --> 00:50:11,340
And so I thought that was really fascinating. I shouldn't be fascinated by that, but

799
00:50:11,340 --> 00:50:14,660
it was just interesting because it's a young industry. But I did tell the crowd,

800
00:50:14,660 --> 00:50:17,860
I said, the only way that this gets traction

801
00:50:18,340 --> 00:50:21,700
in the community is to go into a restaurant

802
00:50:22,260 --> 00:50:26,020
and just ask the Psalm, do you have any Armenian wines? Yes. Because

803
00:50:26,740 --> 00:50:29,340
they're only gonna, they're only gonna put on the list what they think they can

804
00:50:29,340 --> 00:50:33,190
sell. That's their job. Right. And this is sort of the irony of the

805
00:50:33,190 --> 00:50:36,870
wine trade. It's so romantic and so expressive of regions in the world

806
00:50:36,870 --> 00:50:40,470
and cultural. But you got to sell it and it's, you know, you got to

807
00:50:40,470 --> 00:50:44,310
make a buck and the margins are bad. And you know, we do it

808
00:50:44,310 --> 00:50:47,350
because we love it, we're passionate about it. I can see it in you. But

809
00:50:47,350 --> 00:50:50,830
at the same time, the job is consumer based. Exactly.

810
00:50:50,830 --> 00:50:53,830
So, so we go into the restaurant, we say, hey, can I see the wine

811
00:50:53,830 --> 00:50:56,390
list? Oh, you don't have any Armenian wines. And the Psalm goes, hey, you know,

812
00:50:56,390 --> 00:51:00,010
maybe I should look into some Armenian wines. Correct. For there's something important.

813
00:51:00,010 --> 00:51:02,570
We're out. We're actually out of time already. But

814
00:51:05,370 --> 00:51:09,050
one thing that happened in LA about 10 years ago, maybe a little less,

815
00:51:09,050 --> 00:51:12,690
maybe 75 years ago, was that Armenian Wines became

816
00:51:12,690 --> 00:51:16,370
part of the book of more

817
00:51:16,370 --> 00:51:19,850
mainstream distributors. Now here you are, you only do Armenian wines. But

818
00:51:21,050 --> 00:51:24,680
when Masano started carrying wine, when

819
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:28,560
Chambers and Chambers started carrying Armenian wine, that

820
00:51:28,560 --> 00:51:31,640
changed a little bit. That means the salesperson

821
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:36,280
who's out selling Jack Daniels and Camus

822
00:51:36,680 --> 00:51:39,960
also has Armenian wine in their book. Correct. And that's huge.

823
00:51:40,199 --> 00:51:44,040
That's good for you. Yeah, because they, they're making

824
00:51:44,040 --> 00:51:47,760
a lot of sales calls and they're educating a lot of buyers on the fact

825
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:51,080
that these exist. Maybe not yours, but when you get there,

826
00:51:51,730 --> 00:51:55,410
it's not completely new. Have you seen any of that yet? No,

827
00:51:55,650 --> 00:51:58,930
not yet. I mean, I have. That's a good speech for that. Yeah.

828
00:51:59,410 --> 00:52:03,010
No, well, I mean, but. No,

829
00:52:03,170 --> 00:52:06,890
what. I mean, I agree with you. Yeah, I mean, I agree with

830
00:52:06,890 --> 00:52:10,610
what you said and. But it's a long way for me to get

831
00:52:10,610 --> 00:52:14,210
there. Yes, of course, obviously. But. But it's

832
00:52:14,210 --> 00:52:16,930
good. Definitely. It's a very good

833
00:52:18,090 --> 00:52:21,810
that, that those folks, those wholesalers and those distributors

834
00:52:21,810 --> 00:52:24,890
carry the army wines and it's part of their portfolio.

835
00:52:25,370 --> 00:52:28,930
But again, what I noticed, some of the wholesalers, they're like,

836
00:52:28,930 --> 00:52:32,290
hey, what is your. If you want us to carry your wine in

837
00:52:32,290 --> 00:52:36,130
Colorado, if you want to carry your wine in another state,

838
00:52:36,130 --> 00:52:39,730
it's like, do you have a clientele for us? Really? That's the

839
00:52:39,730 --> 00:52:43,530
key. Because they're not going to build your clientele over there. They don't

840
00:52:43,530 --> 00:52:47,280
have time for it. So I have to create my own clientele in those

841
00:52:47,280 --> 00:52:51,000
states before I can approach them. So it's a long way

842
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:55,160
to go for me, it's too far ahead and

843
00:52:55,240 --> 00:52:58,800
I like just to focus on what's current and what's coming

844
00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:00,439
up and

845
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:05,720
grow my business locally through the communicating with

846
00:53:06,600 --> 00:53:09,640
friends, coworkers, family,

847
00:53:11,070 --> 00:53:14,830
those people who have been supporting me and events that

848
00:53:14,830 --> 00:53:18,390
I'm going to and participating and trying to

849
00:53:18,390 --> 00:53:21,950
promote our wines. So that's my focus

850
00:53:21,950 --> 00:53:25,710
right now. And it's been very.

851
00:53:25,950 --> 00:53:29,750
If you would have asked me, hey, Armen, back in the day, what do

852
00:53:29,750 --> 00:53:33,550
you see yourself? Like 6 months ago when we met, how do

853
00:53:33,550 --> 00:53:37,320
you envision yourself six months from now? I

854
00:53:37,320 --> 00:53:38,040
would say

855
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:44,960
I wouldn't be. I would not have that idea that I have right now.

856
00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:48,520
Yeah, that's great. I've been blessed with a great

857
00:53:49,160 --> 00:53:52,880
opportunities that, you know, and I haven't dined alone. I

858
00:53:52,880 --> 00:53:56,360
had a lot of, as I said, a lot of co workers, people.

859
00:53:56,680 --> 00:53:58,840
Well, a lot of friends and

860
00:53:59,800 --> 00:54:03,370
acquaintances, you know, help me in this process. That's great. Well,

861
00:54:03,370 --> 00:54:06,010
we're out of time. Like I Said it's already been 15 minutes. Can you believe

862
00:54:06,010 --> 00:54:09,610
it? But that's what happens when two friends get together. Talk about one. Yeah, right.

863
00:54:09,930 --> 00:54:12,970
It goes back pretty quick. Seems like we can go on and on, you know,

864
00:54:13,290 --> 00:54:17,090
pop one open. Well, I wish you all the luck in the world

865
00:54:17,090 --> 00:54:20,090
and I hope we can do this again in maybe six months from now, a

866
00:54:20,090 --> 00:54:23,690
year from now, where you've experienced more headwinds,

867
00:54:24,170 --> 00:54:27,770
more of this industry. There's a lot of changes going on. There's a

868
00:54:28,250 --> 00:54:31,990
unknown places to land. They don't know, you know, when no

869
00:54:31,990 --> 00:54:35,670
one really knows where some of this is going to go. But you're in

870
00:54:35,670 --> 00:54:38,830
a pretty unique position. You got a niche wine. It's.

871
00:54:39,230 --> 00:54:42,670
It's not going to be market force driven as much as some of this other

872
00:54:42,670 --> 00:54:46,270
stuff. And you're going to be able to, to walk in with a unique

873
00:54:46,270 --> 00:54:49,510
product that no one's seen or heard of or if they have, they haven't tasted

874
00:54:49,510 --> 00:54:53,350
a good one. And like I said, I was very impressed with the

875
00:54:53,350 --> 00:54:57,180
whole lineup, the quality that you found. I appreciate you stopping by

876
00:54:57,180 --> 00:55:00,460
the booth and trying the wines, you know. So, yeah, I mean, we do have

877
00:55:00,460 --> 00:55:04,300
a website, we do have Instagram, we do have all the Facebooks. Well, there's

878
00:55:04,300 --> 00:55:07,460
also some very good looking Armenian women hanging around your booth. So

879
00:55:07,940 --> 00:55:09,060
that's why I went over there

880
00:55:12,580 --> 00:55:16,100
because there's one, Ani dude,

881
00:55:16,980 --> 00:55:20,260
the wine journalist, she was standing right by your booth and

882
00:55:20,830 --> 00:55:24,550
she sees me, she goes, are you Paul? I'm like, wow, good looking Armenian,

883
00:55:24,550 --> 00:55:27,310
tall Armenian girl, wants to know who I am. I'm gonna go talk to her.

884
00:55:27,390 --> 00:55:31,070
Yeah, don't tell my wife. She doesn't

885
00:55:31,070 --> 00:55:34,750
listen to the show. Anyway, thanks for coming

886
00:55:34,750 --> 00:55:38,110
in and saying hi and have a chance to share your story. Paul, thank you

887
00:55:38,110 --> 00:55:41,710
very much for this opportunity. Thank you very much and it was a

888
00:55:41,710 --> 00:55:45,430
pleasure sitting through this conversation. See you next, the next Guinea Fest

889
00:55:45,430 --> 00:55:49,240
or somewhere before. Yes. Yeah. So we're gonna be at the. I'm gonna

890
00:55:49,240 --> 00:55:52,440
be at the Fairplex, Los Angeles Fairplex. Oh, so when is that tasting?

891
00:55:53,080 --> 00:55:56,720
16Th and 17th. I'm doing two. Is it. Are

892
00:55:56,720 --> 00:56:00,360
you displaying there? Yes. So it's. I'm gonna be

893
00:56:00,760 --> 00:56:03,800
a new building. I. I know I saw a picture. They have a new place.

894
00:56:04,520 --> 00:56:08,080
I haven't been there. I'm gonna be there for the first time this weekend to

895
00:56:08,080 --> 00:56:11,560
see how it's set up and everything. But I'm. But

896
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:15,360
next Saturday, Next weekend, Friday and Saturday, I'm doing a

897
00:56:15,360 --> 00:56:18,880
couple of tastings over there. Used to be September 1st to

898
00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:22,720
September 21st. So they moved it in. There's a fair cycle.

899
00:56:23,520 --> 00:56:27,120
You'll probably learn this now because Golden Orange county

900
00:56:27,120 --> 00:56:30,640
has a tasting. Oh, okay. And that starts June

901
00:56:30,720 --> 00:56:34,320
14, usually. So he didn't want to compete with that. Yeah. So they've moved them

902
00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:38,160
around. Delmar. I don't. I don't think San Diego has a tasting.

903
00:56:38,160 --> 00:56:41,760
But then the California State Fair has a huge tasting. Okay. Which is

904
00:56:41,760 --> 00:56:45,090
just before old LA County. So the whole circuit that these guys follow

905
00:56:45,730 --> 00:56:49,050
that you may become familiar with because of all this.

906
00:56:49,050 --> 00:56:52,650
Slowly. Yeah, one. One opens up. One door

907
00:56:52,650 --> 00:56:56,290
opens up. Many more doors here, you know, so. Cheers. Very exciting.

908
00:56:56,290 --> 00:56:56,740
Cheers.