Building Michael Franzese Wines: Samvel Hakobyan’s Immigrant Success Story and Michael Franzese’s Transformation

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The most inspiring, amazing conversation I've had in a long

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time just occurred with Samvel Hakopian. The

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story of his immigration to America and how he connected with

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Michael Franzese, the famed mob boss turned Christian

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in jail. And now bring in a huge brand of

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wine. Incredible conversation. You will be

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stumped, stupefied and amazed. Cheers.

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Sit back and grab a glass. It's Wine

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talks with Paul K.

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Hey, welcome to Wine talks with Paul K. And I am in studio today. But

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to have a conversation with Samvel Jacalpiano from Michael Franzes

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wines introductions in just a minute. Hey, have a, have a watch or

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listen to a great podcast I did completely off subject in

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Paris, Texas, because I got the

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interview the grand champion of one of the major barbecue,

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barbecue blowouts they call them in Paris, Texas. And

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we had a great conversation with him, the president of the chamber of commerce and

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the woman who organizes countrywide these barbecues. And

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by the way, there is such thing as a beef hangover, but not

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while we're here. Here to have a conversation with Samvel Jacopian.

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Welcome to the show. Thank you.

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We've been working hard at doing, trying to do this. Yes, you've been

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amazing, but you know, that's the way it is in

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Hollywood, right? So you gotta persistent. In fact, I had

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a conversation last week with David Zucker, the guy that wrote

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Naked Gun and all those famous slapstick comedies, and

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he's, he's trying to sell a movie now that back to the same kind of

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humor that he wrote back in the 70s. And he said, look, you just can't

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give up, you know, you just can't give up on life, on anything really. And

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in particular in Hollywood when it comes to media. But tell me about, tell

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me about Michael and I, and I always say it wrong.

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Franzess. Franzes. Michael Francis. Francis. See, there

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you go. Tell me about, tell me about his relationship with you and

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how the whole idea of Michael Francis Wines came about.

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Well, there's, it's. It's a very long story, but I'll try to keep it as

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brief as possible. So I was a very big fan of Mr. Michael growing up

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and I always had a dream of one day meeting him.

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So my family, quick backstory. When we first migrated from

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Armenia, my dad was a delivery driver at Papa John's and mom was a

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cashier at Walmart. So we had modest upbringings and the store

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went bankrupt. And my dad decided to say, hey, you know what? We're going to

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take over the store. Well, they're not Qualified. We don't have the finances.

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And they don't even speak English. Right. They just came in

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and went straight into work where speaking wasn't necessarily required.

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And they get tickets and fly out to Kentucky. And in Kentucky, they

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run into Papa John's. They go to the corporate office thinking, this is how you

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go through. And in there, Jon Schnatter sees them and says,

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hey, you guys have to fill out a franchise application. You gotta have a million

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dollars in that word, et cetera, et cetera. Wow. They didn't meet any of the

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standards. But he looks at them and he says, you know what? I have a

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feeling you guys are gonna do a good job. I just wanna know who's gonna

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run the store. Cause you don't speak English, and that's gonna be needed. And with

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the translator, my dad says, our son. And John says, okay,

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no problem. We'll give you guys a shot. Because the store went bankrupt and it

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closed down. And they end up giving them the shot. And we end up taking

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over the store. And within a couple years, it becomes the number one store in

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Northern California. I dropped out of high school at the time to come in and

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help run it and fell in love with the world of business. And I had

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a dream of one day meeting Mr. Michael. And all of this comes

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back into his circles. That's why I'm sharing it. So. So

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fast forward my family. My dad brings friends and family to help

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support get life started in America. They backstabbed, take money away from us,

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and now we're half a million dollars in debt. And we went from running a

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very successful store to opening more businesses to now a collapse.

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And I decided, you know what? I'm going to help my family out of this

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situation. So I went and got a door to door sales job at a new

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open construction company by my friend Bozkin.

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And so April, I started. I'm 19 years old. I have

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no experience in sales, no experience in construction. I just ran a successful

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store, knew how to manage people. And I said, vas, Michael

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Francis is going to be a guest speaker at this event in Texas.

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What do I need to do for you to buy tickets? So I could go

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and I could just hear him speak. And he says, well, Sam, it's your first

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month. I don't know, that's probably a little too ambitious. I said, no, I want

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to meet this man. He said, okay, if you could do $100,000 in

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sales. This is, mind you, this is door to door, knocking on doors, trying to

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sell people roofs and I'm 19, right? I didn't have this much gray hair at

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the time, so they didn't take me seriously. But we end up with

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it. And he says, okay, if you do 100,000, I'll buy it. Well, praise God.

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April 14, I did 138,000 in sales. And he said, I'm going to buy two

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tickets, one for you, one for me. We'll go together. So we go to

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the airport and the flight out of Sacramento gets canceled. Then

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there's another flight and that gets canceled. And I'm like, vaz, I've

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been excited waiting for this. Let me drive and let's fly out of San Francisco.

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He said, okay. So we drive to San Francisco, we miss the flight,

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and then on the next flight, it's a red eye flight, we end up taking

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it. So we end up taking a midnight flight from San Francisco to

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Texas. So Mr. Paul, as we're pulling in,

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as our Uber's dropping this off, Mr. Michael stepping out of the hotel to get

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into that same Uber. So that split second, and

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I immediately go up to him and I say, hey, could I have your phone

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number? You're Michael Francis. Oh, my God, it's been a dream to meet you

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since I was a kid. I love your story of transformation, how you found God.

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You were in the mop. Could I get your phone number? He looks at me,

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he's like, how old are you? I'm like 19. And you're asking for my phone

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number? I said, yes. He's like, well, if you're bold enough to ask it, I'll

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give it to you. At the time, I didn't understand what it means, and he

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gave it. Fast forward a year later. I do

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well in sales. I get recruit marketing, I start a marketing

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agency. Because other roofing companies reached out to me. And I

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decided to. When Covid happens and then the war in Armenia happens,

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I decided to reach out to Michael Francis. I had done well with the marketing

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agency, built it successfully, and I reached out to him

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And I said, Mr. Michael, I would love to meet with you. And he responded

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back. He gave me 30 minute lunch. It ended off being three and a half

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hours together. And during that time, he was getting into the pizza business.

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So I said, look, I have great relationships with the president of Papa

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John's. I would love to introduce you to him and he could help you guys

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expand your operation. And he said, sam, if you make that happen, it would

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be great. So I made the introduction, I flew in again. I was there

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in person when they Met. I helped organize the whole thing. And he looked

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at me and he said, sam, just know that today you made a new friend.

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I'm no longer just Mr. Michael, too, but now we're friends because you did

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something that's helping us grow. And I like you. All that stuff.

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So when the war in Armenia happened, I said, hey, I gotta help Armenia. And

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we can no longer, as a group of people, we

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can't just be victims of what happened in 1915 with April

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24th. We gotta look at the genocide. What have we created? If we're

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just out there with posters yelling for help all day and

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not showing people why they should help us, we're not gonna get any help. And

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the example I bring up is if you have a homeless man asking for 100

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bucks, nobody's going to give it. You have Bruce

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Wayne, I mean, from Christian Bale, or you have Donald Trump or whoever it

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is calls an ask, you're immediately going to give it. Why? The ask is the

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same. It's one's doing something and the other is

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not. So we have to show the world what we've done as people. And

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since we invented winemaking, I decided to bring Armenian wine to the United States

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on a national scale and let people know what this group of people

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are, how we are inventors, how we are creators, and how we've been able to

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last through time. And I realized it would

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be hard to bring an Armenian product to the US Unless I had a leverage

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point. And that's where I called Mr. Michael, and I said, Mr. Michael, you have

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a story of transformation. You're a man that went from becoming, you know, the

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biggest moneymaker in the mob after Al Capone, to finding God and changing

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your life. Let's put the two together. A store of transformation with

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wine from the world's first vineyards and bring something new to the market in a

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way that could be innovative and disruptive. And that's where we started.

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Man. There are so many lessons that you

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just explained it. And I could

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just say the podcast is over now because there were so many interesting

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tangents in there that we know that. I think we just had a mouthful. Wow,

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that is an amazing story. And, you know, one of the

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lessons that just came out of that, and there's many. And this is not enough

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for one podcast, frankly, is

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the. The Armenian entrepreneurial spirit and

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the ability to. To recognize

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opportunity. And, you know, you came from a part of Armenia which

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is, you know, just post Soviet. You know, there's a lot of

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fraud and a lot of Problems, you know, particularly in Armenia right after

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freedom. But that's not your family story. Your family story

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is like my, like the story of my grandparents coming to

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America and starting the carpet store in Hollywood and becoming president

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of Rotary and these, this recognition of,

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of the freedom and the opportunities in front of you. It's an amazing

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thing. When you came here, how old were you? I was

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6 years old when we came to the US and you had. Learned English there,

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or at least studied it there? No, I learned here.

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I learned here. Yeah. I didn't know English when I went to school. First grade.

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And your parents left, what year was that?

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2006. Oh, so. Well, you know, and I

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visited in 2007, the first time. So you. About that

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time was, you know, it's been a few years since freedom, but there's

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still a lot of corruption. The government was still bad. I mean, it's not

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necessarily all that great right now, but it's better. There's. People

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aren't having heart attacks because they started businesses in Yerevan that are. That are

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being taken advantage of. But what was that impetus?

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Why did they do this? They. They did it so because

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they were afraid that I would get drafted into the army. And

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we're very. We're a very Christian family and very spiritual, and

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they just had the feeling that there's going to be war when Sam's 18, 19,

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20, he's going to be drafted in and we're going to lose our son. And

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I was the reason. My dad had a store. He had a nice convenience store

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in Armenia. He was an entrepreneur always. But they left everything and

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moved here just to make sure that doesn't happen to me. And little do you

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know, that's exactly what happens with the war in 2020 and a lot of classmates.

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I had a lot of people that I knew when and didn't come back.

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And that's a. That could be. It's not a political show. We could easily make

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it one really quickly when it comes to that story, but we won't at this

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moment. But yes, you know, let's delve into

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the first Christian nation for a second, because I think this is important and I.

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Some of the Armenians use that as sort of the

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feature. One of the features of the Armenian race is that we are the first

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Nation and what, 400 AD to adopt

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Christianity and as the nation. But most of it

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seems to be we're not Muslim, not that we are strong

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Christians, but we're not Muslims, so that makes

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us Christians. And. But I get from you a

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Very strong sense of the belief. A believer as well.

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My, my son in law, we just got back from Texas. He's an Anglican priest

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in Texas. My other son in law graduated from seminary with a master's in divinity.

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Congratulations. Very strong as well. And I, and I sense that from you. Anyway,

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how did that, how did that become that in your family

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household in a country like Armenia?

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You know, my grandma was the one that brought it. She, she was running a

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furniture store and one of the people that Brother Pavel,

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who's very well known in Armenia in the Christian community, brought the faith

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over a preach to her and she accepted. And so I had the fortune of

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growing up in a Christian family. And I also, as I got

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older, I accepted it fully upon myself as well. Because if you look

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at what the biblical teachings are, and we won't make this into, you know,

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religious episode, but if you, if, when I look at the teachings, it's

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all teachings that if you live by you live love others,

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do unto others that you wish done upon to you. And I've just only seen

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the benefit of it and have felt it and wanted to continue that.

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But it's been our family story and it's something that we actually take a lot

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of pride in. Armenia being the first Christian nation because we've seen how

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much influence Christianity's had. And at the time when Armenia accepted it, it was

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a very powerful country. I mean, this is 300 A.D. where a lot,

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I mean, we're a lot larger than what we were today.

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And it's had a big influence in the spread of it. And, you know,

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it's definitely something to look at. We were pioneers in. Do

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you think that. See if I can

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articulate this the way I want to say it in that as

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Armenians, we like to talk about the things that we brought to the world,

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but we say it as a matter of fact, instead of showing it.

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And I think what you're doing is showing it through this, this project and we'll

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talk about in a second. But your parents come here without,

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without any understanding of what they're going to do, how they're going to get there.

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I don't know. You know, there's lots of many stories of immigrants coming to America

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with $25 sewn in their shoe and that kind of thing, but don't speak the

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language. Land in Fresno or Sacramento.

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Sacramento. And is there some kind of.

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And my father was the same. My father, if he came from Cairo, he didn't

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have much money. He came here, got his master's in Pharmacology and just started opening

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pharmacies. You know, this is, this is what we're born into.

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And I'm trying to figure out if there's a national trait or an

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indigenous trait. This, this ability to

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absorb risk, to take on risk without hesitation

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and to understand, try. Actually maybe not understand the ramifications.

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Just do it, Paul. You know what's interesting?

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So I have. There's a theory that I have and I.

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Sometimes I get in trouble for it, but I'll share it, is there's

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very few real Armenians left because of what we

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witnessed in the genocide. And there was three types of Armenians that survived

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in the genocide. Those that saw what was coming and fled.

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Those that stayed and fought and survived. And those that betrayed,

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they betrayed Christianity. They betrayed their people. So

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in our land, there's only two types that are left. The ones that fled came

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out and created the diaspora. And we've seen amazing success from the diaspora of

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Armenians. There's a lot of real Armenians there. But the ones that left were those

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that stayed and fought who were traumatized, right, because of everything

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they saw. I mean, you can't be the same person after witnessing that

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and fighting for your life against those with guns, with

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shovels and sticks, and those that betrayed. And so those are

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the breeds. And those that stayed and fought every generation are the same

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ones that go out and fight and get less and less and less. But those

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that betray that betrayal, blood and those that were mixed in with the,

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with the Turks has also expanded. So there's very few real Armenians left.

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But when we look at our history, whether it was during Alexander the Great's time,

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he never conquered Armenia, he conquered the known world. But when he came

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and it was Afghanistan and Armenia, he liked the people of Afghanistan because they

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were beautiful looking. I didn't want to mess with them. And he respected the Armenians.

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Depending on which historical context you take is because we were creators.

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And he realized that, hey, I could use these people to build amazing things.

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I don't need to destroy them. Then we look at Genghis Khan. When he came,

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Armenians had made a deal with his father and he respected. And

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when his father asked Armenians because they did a favor for him, there's a whole

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history. All they said is like, look, we see what you guys are doing.

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When you decide to take over, just don't hurt us. And the father signed and

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gave them a letter. So when Genghis Khan kain, he

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appreciated that, collected money from Armenians and left. So there's a

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reason why we have been able to survive. We really haven't

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had enemies. We've been able to get along well with others. And so the

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real Armenians that still have those traits that haven't been messed up by all the

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events that have happened are just some of the most unique people out there

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that's. That's left because we know how to negotiate. We

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have the survival. We're willing to take risk. And we also love helping people. I

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mean, anyone that speaks about Armenia speaks about. Man, you guys are so welcoming. You

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always put great food. We feel like family with you. And that's just who we

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are as people. I think that's DNA for sure. It's.

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I grew up in Southern California in Armenian household. You know, my

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dad spoke five languages. They spoke mostly Turkish in the house because my

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mom spoke Turkish. But it's always funny when you. Particularly in

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the American world, which I respect the American culture greatly because of what

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they've done. Absolutely. But when you meet

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somebody that does it, oh, you're Ian, you're Armenian, and they go and

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they talk about all the great friends they've had in their life

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that, yes, when you talk about a new year coming in, old anxiety and old

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acquaintance be forgot. It brings back these people that were in their

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lives, that were their neighbor or their across the street or the guy that

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owned the market down the street was an Armenian guy. And they always have fond

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memories of those relationships. And I think that's a lot to do with the DNA.

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And I think you're right. I'm interested to know why you get in trouble for

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saying those things, but we'll talk about that later.

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We do have this survivor's instinct,

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and I asked this question of Vahe Kashkeri in an interview, and

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I said, do you have no fear? I mean, I was earnestly like, don't you

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have any fear? He goes, let's just say I was bad at evaluating risk

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because. Because we are an emotional group

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and we are, you know, we have a. We have vision

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and we. We have vision of the future. Like, we know

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that if we pay the dues now and we work hard, we

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can reap those benefits. But we're always looking out. And.

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But one thing that you said that was really interesting,

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salesmanship is. Can be learned. You can learn the

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mechanics of salesmanship. I went to Xerox sales school for two weeks, twice or three

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times, and eight hours a day of sales training. But not everybody comes out

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with the same skill sets or the same determination or the same hard

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work ethic. And that's what salesmanship is. And I try to explain this to a

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young Armenian woman who's now in Napa selling for. For

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a major winery there. I said, it's

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the metrics are going to prove themselves out as you needed to make

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$138,000 or $100,000 to go to Savannah.

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But that's not that come part. Most of that

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comes from your. Once you learn the metrics and the. In the. And the mechanics

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of salesmanship, the perseverance and the personality and the DNA

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takes over, does it not? Yes. And you were out

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shaking the tree because you had an objective, because you wanted to

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go Michael Francis, which is amazing. How did you hear about him

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and what was it about his story that was so intriguing?

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I was 10 years old when my grandfather, my mom's father, brought in

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a dvd, which was a translation in Armenian of

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his testimony he was giving at a church in San Diego. And at the

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time there was. You've probably heard of it. Vodogite

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had come out, which was an Armenian TV series about,

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you know, it was like a mob style. So I fell in love with the

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genre of mob. But I was also a strong Christian, so I got

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a chance to have both best of both worlds and just a transformation

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as someone who achieved wealth and power at a very young age. And

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it was a goal that I had of, you know, achieving, getting to a certain

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point by a certain age at a. Seeing my family go through the struggles they

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did. So it was an inspiring story for me. Well,

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but I guess as a young child, the mob, you

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know, that whole thing is kind of cool. Even though you're a strong Christian, there's

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still a certain amount of humanity to. To what he

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did do and now what he's doing. And how long do you spend

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in jail? So he spent. He served a total

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of eight years where three years was in solitary

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confinement. Really? Yes. Is that where

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he found God? That's where he found God. And the crazy story is.

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And one day when we get him on, he could share it, too. But

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a guard dropped off the Bible in his cell,

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and there was a day where he just wanted to take, you know, just

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for a moment, he had the thought of it's. It's worth ending it all. And

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a guard drops off the Bible that day in his cell. And he had

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fell in love with a woman and. And the mother of that woman, who's now

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his wife for 40 years before he was taken away, said, michael, I'm going

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to be praying for you. And one day I see you speaking to thousands of

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people about God. And at the time, I mean, he's making 500

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million a year cash in his account. He's like, yeah, yeah, whatever.

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But he really says it. He's like, it was that woman's prayers that made that

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guard drop off the Bible that day. And he never saw that guard again.

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Really? And he never saw that guard again. Like an angel.

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Yes. And that moment changed his life. Wow, that's phenomenal.

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He got out. Did he start preaching?

346
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Did he start Bible study? Did he start a

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church? So he was actually recruited by NFL,

348
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NBA, MLB to go. And at the time when he

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was sentenced, FBI came to him and said, look, you're not. You're not

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getting into a deal with this. You're not putting anybody out there. Because he

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never cooperated. He never put anybody in prison, and he never

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cooperated with the government. They said, there's something else we want to offer you. There's

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gambling problem. And if you could go and speak to all of these professional sports

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teams and colleges about the dangers of gambling and how the mob

355
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uses gambling, too, because athletes are very competitive, so they're a

356
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great target for people that want to, you know, bookmaking and all

357
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that stuff. So they made a deal with him to go out and speak to

358
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colleges, and he's spoken with every professional team,

359
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NBA, NFL, mlb. And that's where his career started.

360
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Speaking. And then one of the pastors reached out and said, hey, you have an

361
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amazing testimony. We heard you. One of the athletes heard

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you shared it with us. And. And that's where I took off. He became a

363
00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:20,760
public speaker across. Across the country. He's done over 3,000

364
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speaking engagements. And in the United States, no

365
00:22:24,360 --> 00:22:28,160
3,000 churches, not including all the professional teams. I mean, when we launched

366
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Francis Wine, one of the first customers we had was Bill Belichick from

367
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Patriots. Wow. And he was a. He was a fan of him. And I'm like,

368
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is that. Is that really him? And I look at the domain@patriots.com.

369
00:22:38,940 --> 00:22:42,620
Yeah. And so, yeah, there's girlfriend, right? His.

370
00:22:42,620 --> 00:22:45,980
Lot of news about him and his girlfriend. Oh, yeah, that's. And then

371
00:22:46,140 --> 00:22:49,980
interesting about him getting speaking jobs once he got out

372
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of jail would be. You know, that's a huge issue right now. They just

373
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exposed that major gambling ring. And not only that, it was a

374
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fraudulent gambling ring amongst professional athletes. So that's the

375
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:04,520
timing of that, is when that. When. When that came out.

376
00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:07,840
Mr. Paul, we had about every news media reached out to us.

377
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:11,960
Like, when that news break broke out, we Did a video on YouTube. It

378
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got I think close to 1.5 million views. Like Fox,

379
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CNN, all of them reached out to us to cover it. And, and he became,

380
00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:23,120
you know, it helped grow the brand even further because it brought

381
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more publicity. That's phenomenal. So you, you

382
00:23:26,970 --> 00:23:30,770
become friends, you told the story about how you met him. Talk

383
00:23:30,770 --> 00:23:34,490
about it. Angel of, you know, coming down and plucking

384
00:23:34,490 --> 00:23:38,210
you in front of an Uber driver to the,

385
00:23:38,370 --> 00:23:41,890
to your, your idol growing up and then of course

386
00:23:41,970 --> 00:23:45,690
producing what it's produced. But I like this

387
00:23:45,690 --> 00:23:49,130
idea that, and I'm on the market side of wine. I've been doing it all

388
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my life. You know, it seems to be all my life now. And I spent

389
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all this time in my dad's shop in the 70s. So this is ingrained

390
00:23:56,690 --> 00:23:59,570
in my DNA is the wine business. It's very tough.

391
00:24:00,290 --> 00:24:03,770
And I'm helping a lot of wineries in

392
00:24:03,770 --> 00:24:07,010
Armenia right now try to understand what to do here.

393
00:24:07,650 --> 00:24:11,010
And it's tough. I mean, it's a really tough racket. And your idea to have

394
00:24:11,010 --> 00:24:14,210
some kind of leverage, some kind of hook that would, would

395
00:24:14,690 --> 00:24:18,330
bring Armenian wine to the forefront of the wine public, which is very

396
00:24:18,330 --> 00:24:21,640
difficult to do in any business, let alone wine, but

397
00:24:22,120 --> 00:24:25,800
because alcohol, but salad dressing and toothpaste, all the rest of it just same thing.

398
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:31,600
Was there a winery in Armenia already? Was this your family's winery?

399
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:35,080
How did we stumble across bringing a brand to

400
00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:38,880
America from Armenia? Well, my, the fortune I

401
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:42,560
had is I was, I came from a marketing background. That's what

402
00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:46,120
I, I was self taught in marketing and ran a marketing agency with a great

403
00:24:46,120 --> 00:24:49,580
partner. So when the war happened and I wanted to bring something from

404
00:24:49,580 --> 00:24:53,380
Armenia to the United States and I, in my research, I found that winemaking

405
00:24:53,380 --> 00:24:57,220
originated from Armenia. I'm like, holy smokes. Like, that's a, that's

406
00:24:57,220 --> 00:25:01,020
a huge competitive advantage. Something to really speak on. And then when I told my

407
00:25:01,020 --> 00:25:04,860
dad, I said, dad, look, you know, and personally, you know, I, I wasn't

408
00:25:04,860 --> 00:25:08,540
big into wine or I wasn't a wine connoisseur myself going into it. It was

409
00:25:08,540 --> 00:25:12,220
more of a vision of bringing the world's first wine, bringing

410
00:25:12,220 --> 00:25:15,670
ancient world wine to the new world. And I shared that with my dad and

411
00:25:15,670 --> 00:25:19,510
he said, hey, your uncle actually owns a winery? His cousin. Wow. My father's

412
00:25:19,510 --> 00:25:23,350
cousin. And they grew up together. My grandpa raised them and I said,

413
00:25:23,350 --> 00:25:25,910
great, let's get on a call with him. And he's been in the business for

414
00:25:25,910 --> 00:25:28,950
25 and now it's 30 years. But at the time it was 25 years.

415
00:25:29,670 --> 00:25:33,390
And he said, if we see sent out some samples, Mr. Michael sampled it,

416
00:25:33,390 --> 00:25:37,150
we picked the ones that he really, really liked and that's what we went

417
00:25:37,150 --> 00:25:40,910
forward with. So. But the winery at that time, let's just go back to

418
00:25:40,910 --> 00:25:44,570
2006 when you left and I was there in 2007. This

419
00:25:44,570 --> 00:25:48,290
stuff generally was undrinkable. Okay. We

420
00:25:48,290 --> 00:25:51,650
fast forward a lot of years and, and what's been amazing about the Armenian wine

421
00:25:51,650 --> 00:25:55,170
industry is how fast they've been able to bring the wines

422
00:25:55,170 --> 00:25:58,890
to a competitive nature in the wine world, at least from a

423
00:25:58,890 --> 00:26:02,250
character standpoint. What's in the bottle. But, you know,

424
00:26:03,530 --> 00:26:06,610
in oddity, you're down. I mean, we were down there. I stopped at one of

425
00:26:06,610 --> 00:26:10,250
the roadside kiosks and I tasted the wine the woman made. It's

426
00:26:10,250 --> 00:26:13,770
actually, it's actually pretty decent. I mean, you could actually drink this

427
00:26:13,770 --> 00:26:16,846
stuff. I thought it was gonna be off the charts. 2006,

428
00:26:17,014 --> 00:26:20,090
2007, undrinkable stuff. So

429
00:26:20,650 --> 00:26:24,090
the wines that were being made by your uncle at that moment,

430
00:26:24,330 --> 00:26:27,930
and this is 2000, approximately

431
00:26:27,930 --> 00:26:31,450
what, 15. When one of this, when we started. This, it was

432
00:26:31,450 --> 00:26:35,090
2000. So we launched the brand 2022. We got

433
00:26:35,090 --> 00:26:38,840
incorporated. 2023 was our first year of business. So they've. They had

434
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,280
a chance and they obviously have updated the

435
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:45,720
winery, come to modern techniques, creating wines of

436
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,560
character. Tell me what you think about Odiny as a grape and the. On

437
00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:53,200
the worldwide as a marketeer. Tell me about

438
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,000
Odiny as a grape. What you see.

439
00:26:57,360 --> 00:27:01,040
Audeny is a. Is a fantastic. It's very approachable

440
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:04,880
and it's a great wine to introduce people who just want to get started

441
00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:08,250
in the wine. And Mr. Paul, as you know, what makes Armenian

442
00:27:08,250 --> 00:27:12,050
winemaking special is, you know, a lot of the wineries don't add sulfites to

443
00:27:12,050 --> 00:27:15,890
the wine. We have. We have rich oxygen in our soil.

444
00:27:15,890 --> 00:27:19,690
With the black soil, we have nine months of sun, high elevation. So

445
00:27:19,690 --> 00:27:23,330
Armenian wines are very, very approachable. And one of the comments we always

446
00:27:23,330 --> 00:27:26,890
get, because we do a lot of samples, a lot of demos, one of the

447
00:27:26,890 --> 00:27:30,490
comments we get is, man, this is dangerous. It's dangerously good, it's easy to

448
00:27:30,490 --> 00:27:34,230
drink, it goes down. And to your point about increasing

449
00:27:34,230 --> 00:27:37,910
the wine quality in Armenia, one of the things we had is

450
00:27:37,910 --> 00:27:41,750
Russia has spoiled us. Right? Because I mean, and not

451
00:27:41,750 --> 00:27:45,110
to make any national claims, but a lot of the Russians would drink whatever

452
00:27:45,110 --> 00:27:48,910
alcohol it's there. They just love alcohol and there nobody could out drink

453
00:27:48,910 --> 00:27:52,430
the Russians. I mean, they won World War II and that's documented because of

454
00:27:52,430 --> 00:27:56,070
alcohol. So our producers were used to just making

455
00:27:56,230 --> 00:27:59,790
wine, whatever it was, and exporting it out to Russia. And

456
00:27:59,790 --> 00:28:03,150
Russians will buy it. And as long as it was chip cheap and it. And

457
00:28:03,150 --> 00:28:06,710
it gave them the effect of alcohol, then they would buy it. What happened is

458
00:28:06,710 --> 00:28:10,510
as Russia's market started to slow down, they had to realize that, hey, we

459
00:28:10,510 --> 00:28:13,230
can't just depend on Russia buying our wine. And that's sort of the time where

460
00:28:13,230 --> 00:28:16,910
we came in and Europe had a higher standard. And what

461
00:28:16,910 --> 00:28:20,550
I'm proud of our people is they actually really innovated and they started meeting those

462
00:28:20,550 --> 00:28:24,330
standards so they could start exporting to Europe. They could start exporting to. To

463
00:28:24,330 --> 00:28:28,010
the United States. So I think opening up other markets forced them to

464
00:28:28,010 --> 00:28:31,810
also increase the quality, not just focus on quantity. Where else they wouldn't

465
00:28:31,810 --> 00:28:35,490
be able to make it in other markets? Well, I. That part I know. You

466
00:28:35,490 --> 00:28:38,290
know, it's interesting. I had a conversation with a.

467
00:28:39,250 --> 00:28:42,970
With an Italian house and another Russian oligarch that

468
00:28:42,970 --> 00:28:46,210
decided to go to Tuscany and build this winery. Then there's. There's

469
00:28:46,290 --> 00:28:50,140
Voskavas. I mean, everybody knows the. They're. I think

470
00:28:50,140 --> 00:28:52,780
the Oeans have, you know, Russian

471
00:28:53,900 --> 00:28:57,620
distribution ties, and they took their money, brought it to Armenia

472
00:28:57,620 --> 00:29:01,460
outside of Yvonne to build a winery. So I think the, you

473
00:29:01,460 --> 00:29:04,820
know, the Russians have relegated Armenia to

474
00:29:04,820 --> 00:29:08,340
brandy during this time. But in

475
00:29:08,340 --> 00:29:11,820
today's economy in America, with the

476
00:29:11,820 --> 00:29:15,540
congestion of wine, with the consumption dropping a bit,

477
00:29:15,540 --> 00:29:19,230
with the shelves being, you know, a shelf talker on

478
00:29:19,230 --> 00:29:22,550
every shelf in every market that, you know, you walk in there as a consumer,

479
00:29:22,550 --> 00:29:26,230
you're barraged by yellow tags. Bringing

480
00:29:26,230 --> 00:29:30,030
a grape that no one's heard of, oddity from a district that no

481
00:29:30,030 --> 00:29:33,790
one's ever heard of. You know, viad store, wherever you're coming from, and

482
00:29:33,790 --> 00:29:37,590
putting on the shelf as a marketeer, how has that

483
00:29:37,590 --> 00:29:41,430
been? And I'm so impressed with what you guys have done so far. But how.

484
00:29:41,820 --> 00:29:45,620
What kind of headwinds have you encountered and how did you overcome

485
00:29:45,620 --> 00:29:48,940
them? So I'll. I'll share a trade secret here.

486
00:29:49,100 --> 00:29:51,500
And it's. Hey, hold on a second. You know, we got.

487
00:29:53,020 --> 00:29:56,700
It's. Everything is about positioning. So when I met with

488
00:29:56,780 --> 00:30:00,500
Josh Schnatter, Papa Johns, he. He recommended I read a book,

489
00:30:00,500 --> 00:30:04,300
positioning. And everything is positioning. And if I went to market and

490
00:30:04,300 --> 00:30:08,060
I said, hey, and wine is also known for stories, right?

491
00:30:08,060 --> 00:30:11,820
People want to hear a great story with it. And when we came

492
00:30:11,820 --> 00:30:15,500
to market, I didn't even talk about Armenian wines. I mean, when we went to

493
00:30:15,500 --> 00:30:19,220
the presentations, when we Met with Kroger. That was the first chain we landed.

494
00:30:20,980 --> 00:30:24,500
All I spoke about was, this is wine from the world's first

495
00:30:24,500 --> 00:30:28,260
vineyards. So if I was to

496
00:30:28,260 --> 00:30:32,100
put up shelf talkers that say, hey, try aud any, and you have hints

497
00:30:32,100 --> 00:30:35,820
of cherry and pepper and blah, blah, blah, I'm not standing out

498
00:30:35,820 --> 00:30:39,010
from anyone else when I make a claim of saying, hey, after

499
00:30:39,010 --> 00:30:42,730
6,200 years, taste what we have learned. It piques

500
00:30:42,730 --> 00:30:45,930
people's curiosity. So it's a matter of understanding psychology. And

501
00:30:46,650 --> 00:30:50,330
when we first came out, Mr. Paul, a lot of Armenians made

502
00:30:50,330 --> 00:30:53,930
fun of me and the Armenian market didn't accept us. I went to LA myself

503
00:30:53,930 --> 00:30:57,570
and I tried to ask help from others. Nobody brought us on. Like, we have

504
00:30:57,570 --> 00:31:01,330
not even tapped into the Armenian market yet. When we first launched,

505
00:31:01,330 --> 00:31:05,060
they said, why would you put an Italian's name on an Armenian wine? Well, if

506
00:31:05,060 --> 00:31:08,740
that Italian has 2 million followers and has an amazing story, and we should

507
00:31:08,740 --> 00:31:12,500
be proud that an Italian is putting their name on an Armenian

508
00:31:12,500 --> 00:31:16,100
bottle of wine. When I went to a room full of Italians in New

509
00:31:16,100 --> 00:31:18,980
Jersey that showed up for one of the events we were doing, I had to

510
00:31:18,980 --> 00:31:21,820
get up and explain to them why an Italian put their name on an Armenian

511
00:31:21,820 --> 00:31:25,500
bottle. Yeah, that's the opposite. It's supposed to be the

512
00:31:25,500 --> 00:31:29,340
opposite. So a lot of branding and marketing and

513
00:31:29,340 --> 00:31:32,760
just removing. And the thing is,

514
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:37,280
wine industry is filled with a lot of passionate people about their product, and

515
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:40,640
therefore there's a lot of bias that hinders them from growing and

516
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:44,320
marketing. They all think inside out, right? They're like, hey,

517
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,560
here's what I know and let me communicate that out. Where we should think is

518
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:51,400
outside in what are the people thinking, what are the people desiring? And how do

519
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:55,080
we bring that inside and leverage what's already existing

520
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:58,870
to communicate. Communicate the desire that's in the

521
00:31:58,870 --> 00:32:02,630
exterior from the opportunities we have in the interior. So that's what we

522
00:32:02,630 --> 00:32:06,270
did. It's like, hey, the industry is dropping, but it's not dropping

523
00:32:06,270 --> 00:32:09,790
because people stopped consuming. It's because the industry

524
00:32:09,950 --> 00:32:13,230
just is used to the old way of doing things. They're used to just doing

525
00:32:13,230 --> 00:32:16,990
tastings, samplings, restaurants. We took the whole social media

526
00:32:16,990 --> 00:32:19,550
approach of this is where people spend a lot of their time. This is where

527
00:32:19,550 --> 00:32:22,470
they have to discover us. And that's what's going to lead them to go and

528
00:32:22,470 --> 00:32:26,250
make a purchase. You know, okay, they're going to stop you

529
00:32:26,250 --> 00:32:29,850
there, because that's really important stuff. And this is, you know, I spent, you know,

530
00:32:29,850 --> 00:32:33,570
the last years of my company, you know, I'VE said this before, but I

531
00:32:33,570 --> 00:32:37,250
sent 33 million emails in 2022

532
00:32:37,250 --> 00:32:41,090
alone. Wow. And posted daily and wrote

533
00:32:41,090 --> 00:32:44,930
300 pieces of content, took 300 images and you know,

534
00:32:44,930 --> 00:32:48,210
the whole thing. And we did that prolifically because if you think about it, and

535
00:32:48,210 --> 00:32:52,050
maybe you're too young for the TV show Bewitched, but in Bewitched,

536
00:32:52,050 --> 00:32:55,630
you know, the Larry Tate owned this PR agenc, they did

537
00:32:55,630 --> 00:32:59,350
a, you know, an easel presentation of the next pitch and

538
00:32:59,350 --> 00:33:02,990
then of course, the, the client approves that. And it takes weeks, if not

539
00:33:02,990 --> 00:33:06,790
months to get that message into a newspaper, magazine or on tv. Right.

540
00:33:06,870 --> 00:33:10,670
But today you and I could start that in a few minutes. We could

541
00:33:10,670 --> 00:33:14,470
start a campaign on something. Barrier sanctuary has lowered. We can see

542
00:33:14,470 --> 00:33:17,830
if it works and change directions in two hours if we wanted to. But that's.

543
00:33:17,830 --> 00:33:20,950
And so that's really important part. That's where people are hanging out. But do you

544
00:33:20,950 --> 00:33:24,110
think the Armenian. This is gonna be tongue in cheek question, you know, because

545
00:33:26,980 --> 00:33:30,540
both dying hard, Armenian DNA. But do you think the Armenian

546
00:33:30,540 --> 00:33:34,300
pride is part of what gets in the way of this idea of

547
00:33:34,300 --> 00:33:37,620
letting an Italian on my label as well as

548
00:33:38,260 --> 00:33:40,740
not growing Chardonnay, Cabernet, Merlot and the rest?

549
00:33:44,340 --> 00:33:48,020
Yes, I agree with you. And if you look at the

550
00:33:48,100 --> 00:33:51,700
problem amongst everything about our culture and our people and all like

551
00:33:52,050 --> 00:33:55,810
the one big flaw in our DNA is that pride.

552
00:33:56,770 --> 00:34:00,450
And it's. And we don't understand how to use it properly. And it

553
00:34:00,450 --> 00:34:04,170
creates, and we're, and it creates a very closed loop where we're not open

554
00:34:04,170 --> 00:34:07,929
to taking in. But I think, Mr. Paul, with what you're

555
00:34:07,929 --> 00:34:11,130
doing and why I'm a big fan of yours and I applaud you is I

556
00:34:11,130 --> 00:34:14,650
also think a lot of it is a lack of education. They don't know the

557
00:34:14,650 --> 00:34:18,140
benefits. They don't understand. If you were to go and tell any Armenian winemaker,

558
00:34:18,450 --> 00:34:22,290
hey, we could 10x your sales by doing this and actually

559
00:34:22,290 --> 00:34:25,730
show them evidence and give them a guarantee they will do whatever you tell them.

560
00:34:26,050 --> 00:34:29,770
But because they, they only know what they know and they don't know what they

561
00:34:29,770 --> 00:34:33,290
don't know. And that's what creates a big thing. And because of the success of

562
00:34:33,290 --> 00:34:36,090
Francis Wine, we have a lot of wineries we're working with in Armenia now and

563
00:34:36,090 --> 00:34:39,490
everyone wants to work with us. I get reached out every single day by new

564
00:34:39,490 --> 00:34:43,330
wineries giving me the best deal. I mean, we, we've imported

565
00:34:43,330 --> 00:34:46,829
over this this year. We've done over 20 containers of just

566
00:34:46,829 --> 00:34:50,629
auditing in the U.S. wow. Not, not including the other one. So. And we're

567
00:34:50,629 --> 00:34:54,309
growing that and I think we're going to drive this revolution. And

568
00:34:54,309 --> 00:34:57,909
what, what my goal is is eventually is to become that bridge that could

569
00:34:57,909 --> 00:35:01,709
help Armenian made products get into United States and leverage

570
00:35:01,709 --> 00:35:04,789
our network of retail relationships. Walmart, Costco,

571
00:35:05,109 --> 00:35:08,869
Albertsons, Kroger, all of these relationships to

572
00:35:08,869 --> 00:35:12,650
bring in really good quality products in a way that the product is going

573
00:35:12,650 --> 00:35:16,130
to move off the shelf. So the packaging, the branding, all of that. So God

574
00:35:16,130 --> 00:35:19,610
willing, that's the goal of the. For the next five years

575
00:35:19,850 --> 00:35:23,530
after we have, you know, after we establish Francis, we have a

576
00:35:23,530 --> 00:35:27,049
couple more years to really reach the level of scale we have an opportunity to

577
00:35:27,049 --> 00:35:30,570
reaching. Let's talk about that for a second. Now we're into the marketing.

578
00:35:32,090 --> 00:35:35,610
There's this whole movement now. I'm old school to a certain

579
00:35:35,610 --> 00:35:39,430
extent. I mean tonight at New Year's Eve I'm opening very fancy, probably a

580
00:35:39,430 --> 00:35:43,150
couple of bottles of first growth. Bordeaux is a celebration of, of

581
00:35:43,150 --> 00:35:46,830
a lot of things in our lives and just being alive and being able to

582
00:35:46,830 --> 00:35:50,590
do what we get to do and tell these stories. And so I'm so

583
00:35:50,590 --> 00:35:54,430
old school that way. But I don't think. And there's this whole

584
00:35:54,430 --> 00:35:58,110
movement of rethinking the wine trade and what

585
00:35:58,110 --> 00:36:01,950
you've done is rethought things, right? You look, like you said you're looking at

586
00:36:01,950 --> 00:36:04,470
the outside in trying to figure out what people are doing, where they're hanging out,

587
00:36:04,470 --> 00:36:08,150
what the messaging should be. And I think it's, I think that's just good marketing,

588
00:36:08,310 --> 00:36:12,070
whether it's wine or, or widgets. But

589
00:36:12,950 --> 00:36:16,630
what's in the bottle's got to be solid, right? You can't,

590
00:36:17,190 --> 00:36:20,710
you can't bamboozle the wine world. Here's what happened.

591
00:36:21,590 --> 00:36:24,710
One of the reasons I sold the company in 2023 was because

592
00:36:25,270 --> 00:36:29,070
I was not getting the quality merchandise I used to get when I

593
00:36:29,070 --> 00:36:32,920
was in a different model. And the model was always to look

594
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:36,840
in the corners of warehouses and wineries for the stuff that

595
00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:40,600
they forgot about, didn't know about as well as which was

596
00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,400
Trader Joe's model when they first started selling wine.

597
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:48,200
But that's, that evolved into 50 cent a liter

598
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:51,720
crap coming from Europe and being bottled on different brands, sold on,

599
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:55,560
on YouTube and Groupon. You know, 12 bottles for 50 bucks

600
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,160
free shipping and they're even making a few bucks on top of that.

601
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,640
And I think the gov, I think the public just said, you know, this stuff

602
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,720
isn't any good. And so they get one sale and they're done. There was no

603
00:37:06,720 --> 00:37:10,440
Loyalty. And so we can rethink the messaging

604
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:14,280
all we want, which you've done, but you got to make sure

605
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:17,640
that stuff in the bottle is representative. What you're telling them it

606
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,480
represents. Well, if it doesn't, then you're a fraudster.

607
00:37:21,720 --> 00:37:25,520
Right. If you, if you're, if the product itself isn't good

608
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,130
and you're marketing it as good, that's fraud. It's not. Not business. Yeah. So we're,

609
00:37:29,130 --> 00:37:32,810
we're, we're taking into assumption that you're bringing in a great product

610
00:37:33,130 --> 00:37:35,930
and you're looking at, okay, now how do we make people. And to your point,

611
00:37:35,930 --> 00:37:39,770
Mr. Paul, it's across every industry we have this issue.

612
00:37:39,930 --> 00:37:43,689
I mean, we saw it happen in 2008 in the United States. Greed always

613
00:37:43,689 --> 00:37:47,410
gets in. And that's why you have recessions and why recessions are very healthy,

614
00:37:47,410 --> 00:37:50,730
because they filter it out. It. It becomes a reset system.

615
00:37:51,610 --> 00:37:54,810
And so that's what the industry is going through right now. And it's going to

616
00:37:54,810 --> 00:37:57,490
be a matter of, hey, are we going to be able to adapt? Are we

617
00:37:57,490 --> 00:38:01,250
going to be able to meet the customer where the customer is the consumer?

618
00:38:01,570 --> 00:38:04,130
Are we going to continue doing things the old way? And that's why, I mean,

619
00:38:04,130 --> 00:38:07,970
look, the industry's down, but you look at what Josh is doing, right? Billions

620
00:38:07,970 --> 00:38:11,170
of dollars in sales is why. Because they understand the customer.

621
00:38:13,170 --> 00:38:16,650
They understand the consumer psychology and the consumer behavior. They're meeting the

622
00:38:16,650 --> 00:38:20,490
customer where the customer is. They're not expecting the customer to come and meet them

623
00:38:20,490 --> 00:38:24,200
where they are. That has changed. That world has evolved. It's the

624
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:28,280
category shift that's happening across all industries. And now it's come to the white

625
00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:31,960
space. And those that are able to adapt are going to be able to

626
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:35,160
thrive and ride the next wave. And those that don't,

627
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:39,079
aren't. But the product has to be good. If it's not and you're promoting it,

628
00:38:39,079 --> 00:38:42,120
that it's good, it's just simply fraud. That's a really good point.

629
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:46,200
What it came down to me, for me, during all this and selling a lot

630
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:49,400
of wine with, you know, the metrics were very important. You follow the metrics

631
00:38:50,530 --> 00:38:53,930
and you can manipulate the metrics as best you can. Roas and all the rest

632
00:38:53,930 --> 00:38:56,490
of the things that you follow when you're trying to sell a bottle of wine,

633
00:38:56,490 --> 00:38:59,330
particularly on the web, but

634
00:39:01,010 --> 00:39:04,450
you, and you use those metrics to refine what your

635
00:39:04,450 --> 00:39:07,570
messaging is and what you're missing. But it had to be that

636
00:39:07,890 --> 00:39:11,410
somebody opened that bottle of wine and went, wow,

637
00:39:11,570 --> 00:39:14,930
you know, or they served the dinner with their friends and they said, wow, where

638
00:39:14,930 --> 00:39:18,730
did you get this? And that's how that message. You know, it's funny because social

639
00:39:18,730 --> 00:39:20,530
networking, I, I had to tell this

640
00:39:22,270 --> 00:39:25,710
marketeer that came into my office because the idea of social

641
00:39:25,710 --> 00:39:29,310
networking was the same as it always has been when they started

642
00:39:29,390 --> 00:39:33,230
doing. And that is one tells 10, tells 10, tells 10, tell 10. It has

643
00:39:33,230 --> 00:39:37,070
a hundred thousand people know the message, right? That's what it's all about. But

644
00:39:37,070 --> 00:39:40,670
that, that also happens in conversation at

645
00:39:40,670 --> 00:39:44,390
dinner time with friends over bottles. They shake a picture of the bottle,

646
00:39:44,390 --> 00:39:46,470
they take a picture of the back label. What they do and they tell their

647
00:39:46,470 --> 00:39:50,220
friends. That's the same story, right? But they're not going to do

648
00:39:50,220 --> 00:39:53,380
that unless what's in the bottle is quality. In fact,

649
00:39:54,820 --> 00:39:57,940
there was an auction here in LA for an Armenian

650
00:39:58,020 --> 00:40:00,980
importer. Won't throw anybody under the bus,

651
00:40:01,700 --> 00:40:03,540
but they were selling brandy

652
00:40:05,380 --> 00:40:09,220
in collectible bottles, swords, animal figures,

653
00:40:09,700 --> 00:40:13,300
trucks, all kinds of stuff. And my son in law,

654
00:40:13,300 --> 00:40:17,130
who's a nodar, was excited because he was able

655
00:40:17,130 --> 00:40:19,290
to buy these things for a dollar. And I said, look,

656
00:40:20,890 --> 00:40:24,530
if it's Armenian branding, it's VSOP in

657
00:40:24,530 --> 00:40:27,290
this five years and they're going bankrupt.

658
00:40:28,330 --> 00:40:32,130
It's not because the stuff was too good, right. And, and I

659
00:40:32,130 --> 00:40:35,930
haven't had a chance to taste it. I'm convinced that it's going to

660
00:40:35,930 --> 00:40:39,250
be what you're talking about. It's going to be that sort of fraudulent. Not fraudulent.

661
00:40:39,250 --> 00:40:42,970
I won't, I won't accuse the person of fraud, but putting in lousy

662
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:47,160
distilled spirits into a creative container

663
00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:50,440
and trying to pawn it off as something interesting

664
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:55,240
though he's done very well with it on Facebook, Marketplace. After he bought it,

665
00:40:56,360 --> 00:41:00,080
he paid a dollar for these things anyway, so let me,

666
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:03,640
let's have some fun. I have people

667
00:41:03,720 --> 00:41:06,840
sending me youtubes of Michael

668
00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:11,170
in Costco. You know, stopping people in the aisles

669
00:41:11,250 --> 00:41:14,050
and grabbing a bottle and telling the story.

670
00:41:15,170 --> 00:41:18,650
Was that your idea? And two, the response seems like it's

671
00:41:18,650 --> 00:41:22,410
incredible. Yeah, we did it. We were actually together, we did it

672
00:41:22,410 --> 00:41:25,930
at Costco. I mean we've, we've done all of them together in Costco. When we

673
00:41:25,930 --> 00:41:29,610
did it in Irvine, the store sold out. The video got a hundred thousand organic

674
00:41:29,610 --> 00:41:33,130
views. Wow. People were sharing it. And it's again, it's like the

675
00:41:33,130 --> 00:41:35,580
messaging. How sticky is it? What's the positioning of.

676
00:41:37,090 --> 00:41:40,170
And he's, he's done an incredible job with Mr. Michael. I mean the amount of

677
00:41:40,170 --> 00:41:43,810
work he's put in and the amount of support has Been incredible. It's become a

678
00:41:43,810 --> 00:41:47,250
full time job for both of us at this point. And for him,

679
00:41:48,210 --> 00:41:51,889
he was really big on the quality first. At first we brought in some SKUs

680
00:41:51,889 --> 00:41:54,610
that are no longer there with us. So when we spoke about quality, I want

681
00:41:54,610 --> 00:41:57,610
to give him credit on that too. He says, sam, if my name and my

682
00:41:57,610 --> 00:42:01,290
thumbprint is on, on this bottle, it better be dang good. And you

683
00:42:01,290 --> 00:42:04,390
know, yeah, so he's, he's played a big role. But yeah,

684
00:42:04,790 --> 00:42:07,830
social media, we manage the YouTube and everything. So our team

685
00:42:08,790 --> 00:42:11,750
is behind all the production. Every video you see, we touch it.

686
00:42:12,310 --> 00:42:15,510
Let's talk about your copy for a little second. We're almost out of time, oddly.

687
00:42:15,510 --> 00:42:19,350
And again, why I said with this, probably not enough for one podcast.

688
00:42:19,350 --> 00:42:23,110
But you did you start

689
00:42:23,110 --> 00:42:26,870
the marketing firm prior to the wine

690
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:31,840
thing because you had been so successful selling door to door roofing

691
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,960
and then realized, you know, whatever inclination to marketing and

692
00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:38,800
salesmanship you gained on the street,

693
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:43,360
you turned into an organization. Yes.

694
00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:47,600
And tell me about that process. I mean, like risk.

695
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:52,320
So when I was, when I was 19 and doing well in sales, the

696
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:56,070
suppliers, I was rewarded with salesman of the year, all that stuff. Praise God, for

697
00:42:56,470 --> 00:43:00,030
I was never really a good salesman. I just looked at how do I help

698
00:43:00,030 --> 00:43:03,870
people solve their problems. I was really good in math. My grandfather, my

699
00:43:03,870 --> 00:43:07,630
grandpa was, it's funny, when he was on his deathbed and I said, grandpa, is

700
00:43:07,630 --> 00:43:10,950
there a wish that you have that you never achieved? Because we did a lot

701
00:43:10,950 --> 00:43:13,950
of stuff for my grandpa. We loved him. He said, I wanted to be a

702
00:43:13,950 --> 00:43:17,070
math professor. That was the only dream that was left that wasn't achieved. I'm like,

703
00:43:17,070 --> 00:43:20,910
okay, no problem. That's not, I'm glad, I'm glad you're finishing off with that.

704
00:43:20,910 --> 00:43:24,580
So I love Nat's personal problem solving. So I always looked at sales

705
00:43:24,580 --> 00:43:27,980
of how do I help the person solve a problem? And so when I was

706
00:43:27,980 --> 00:43:31,300
doing well in sales, other roofing companies reached out and said, sam, can you come

707
00:43:31,300 --> 00:43:35,060
and do sales consulting for us? And I made sure they weren't competitors to

708
00:43:35,060 --> 00:43:38,500
my friend's company. And as I went out and did it, I'm like, you guys

709
00:43:38,500 --> 00:43:42,100
don't have a sales problem. You have a marketing problem. You're calling people and telling

710
00:43:42,100 --> 00:43:44,580
them, hey, you'll get a free roof and a free solar. And you're going in

711
00:43:44,580 --> 00:43:48,210
there trying to grab 60, $80,000 off of someone living off Social Security security.

712
00:43:48,210 --> 00:43:52,050
You can't do that. So they said, well, how do

713
00:43:52,050 --> 00:43:54,930
we fix it? I said, you got to get better leads. Can you help us?

714
00:43:54,930 --> 00:43:58,130
And I said, sure. So I went, I googled, learned how to do marketing within

715
00:43:58,130 --> 00:44:01,930
three days, signed my first client that week. They paid 2, 500

716
00:44:01,930 --> 00:44:05,770
bucks to start. And that's where the marketing started. Wow,

717
00:44:05,930 --> 00:44:09,650
that's great. Yeah. Talk about. That's Armenian. No

718
00:44:09,650 --> 00:44:13,410
fear of risk. I mean, just, you know what, we'll figure it out

719
00:44:13,410 --> 00:44:16,740
along the way. And I feel proud that I have some of that.

720
00:44:17,140 --> 00:44:19,620
I got it from my father who came to America. The same story.

721
00:44:22,260 --> 00:44:26,060
This has been a really fun conversation, and I did. I

722
00:44:26,060 --> 00:44:29,220
was actually having trouble deciding which direction I wanted to take it because there's so

723
00:44:29,220 --> 00:44:33,020
many different tangents and so many interesting pieces of this. And we could

724
00:44:33,020 --> 00:44:36,180
have the conversation about Armenian religion, we could have the conversation about

725
00:44:36,180 --> 00:44:39,900
entrepreneurship, we have the conversation about wine and the conversation

726
00:44:39,900 --> 00:44:43,730
about social networking and marketing and social. We could have all these conversations at

727
00:44:43,730 --> 00:44:47,290
separate times. But I won't take any more time today. We've already gone 45

728
00:44:47,290 --> 00:44:51,130
minutes plus. And I think it's been an opportunity for

729
00:44:51,130 --> 00:44:54,730
us to grow a little bit more on some of these

730
00:44:54,730 --> 00:44:58,170
subjects together. I think there's a lot of fun things in storytelling

731
00:44:58,810 --> 00:45:02,250
to communicate to the. To the world. That's.

732
00:45:02,570 --> 00:45:06,330
That's what sets. That's what's going to set it all apart. Yes.

733
00:45:06,570 --> 00:45:10,300
And I see you have Mount Arad behind you, and I think I took

734
00:45:10,300 --> 00:45:14,020
that same picture when I was in Ottomany. That's headed down the highway right

735
00:45:14,020 --> 00:45:17,380
there, isn't it? Yes. Somebody.

736
00:45:17,380 --> 00:45:20,580
Somebody. I had to take it from the moving car and it still came out.

737
00:45:20,580 --> 00:45:24,300
Really cool. Yeah. Oughta add something special for all

738
00:45:24,300 --> 00:45:28,020
of us. Are you do. Are you due there in any recent. Any

739
00:45:28,180 --> 00:45:31,940
future time? I'm trying to set up an interview

740
00:45:31,940 --> 00:45:35,420
with. Right now with Patrick, but David and the Prime Minister.

741
00:45:37,100 --> 00:45:40,060
So if we do set that up, then it'll be my first visit. I haven't

742
00:45:40,060 --> 00:45:43,740
been to Armenia. I haven't been

743
00:45:43,740 --> 00:45:46,780
back since we left, so. Wow. Interesting. Okay.

744
00:45:47,500 --> 00:45:50,460
So thank you so much for taking the time. I know it's been hard to

745
00:45:50,460 --> 00:45:53,620
get a hold of everybody and make it work, but this worked great and I

746
00:45:53,620 --> 00:45:56,900
really appreciate the time and I hope we can do it again. I really appreciate

747
00:45:56,900 --> 00:46:00,620
you, Mr. Paul. Thank you for what you're doing and for putting this together.

748
00:46:00,700 --> 00:46:01,340
Thank you.